Here are a few added suggestions Clean Metabolism and Toxin Filters: If you are going to go full nanoware with regards to blood cells, these might be a necessity. This will keep the body safe from bacterial infections, and help protect it from toxic atmospheres (since the only two planets with earth-like gravity are Venus and Earth, that's probably essential). Bodysculpting: A full-body modification to add feathers might be recommended to provide optimal airflow during flight. Of course, this can be mitigated simply by wearing a flight suit instead. Modified Gliding Membrane: This actually increases the aerodynamic capabilities of the morph overall. While actually flying, keeping them open will improve the ability to sustain altitude and reduce drag. The modification would be to make the membrane much smaller, designed to simply improve the morph's profile than to grant full gliding capability by themselves (they supplement the wings, which can glide as well). Low Pressure and Temperature Tolerance: For obvious reasons. High-altitude flight would necessitate modifications to make the morph more tolerant to the harsher conditions at such an elevation. As for my character? He'll just stick to his Cherub-brand Neotenic with wings that come stock.

Axel the Chimeric wrote:

The general idea of this sort of thing is to try to have your cake and eat it too. A neo-avian morph is fine and dandy but it doesn't hold quite the same allure. Anchoring points can always be added artificially, though we're talking about adding more mass there. Flight suits could be used to provide increased aerodynamics without altering the morph itself (which are handier since a smart light vacsuit could include other features, like reshaping its surface to aid in turning and speed). Replacing the cervical vertibrae with more numerous smaller bones and compensating for the reduced structure with increased muscle and flexibility in the veins/esophagus would allow for increased head rotation. Some neck extension might be necessary but it would best be minimalized to avoid the uncanny valley. Reducing the legs and removing the arms would basically hobble any other mode of flight and of interaction. That's the biggest point of contention. I'm not really sure how to deal with that one.

I think the uncanny valley is unavoidable. An aerodynamic profile combined with musculature designed to be strong but lightweight is going to make for a very slender body. Like crazy-slender. Like "starving Ethiopian child the size of a full-grown adult with wings" slender. There's no way to make it look naturally human and get light enough for flight... unless it's a mostly-hollow synthmorph design (which would allow you to implement plenty of other modifications to ensure flight).

Azathoth wrote:

I remember reading something a long time ago about translating the biomechanics of flight to human-sized beings (I believe it was specifically debunking angels, or something). IIRC, it concluded that the wing sized required could conceivably fit on a human frame, but one of the most radical changes to human physiology required would be a keeled sternum of something like 3 ft. I'm sure the muscle augmentation would go a long way towards increasing wing muscle strength, but a keeled sternum would provide leverage to make sure that strength wouldn't go to waste.

Ah yes, I forgot about the carina. Of course, transhuman research could theoretically come up with alternatives that don't require such a sternum extension... after all, genetic engineering means that we're no longer limited to what evolution can provide us.

Azathoth wrote:

Couldn't the same be said for the "starving Ethiopian child" look or the feathers? :P I'm sure if you reduce the weight of the morph enough and have engineered muscle fibers capable of greater force than a bird's muscles then the size of the keel can be greatly reduced, but the presence of a keel should improve efficiency.

That was kind of the reason I recommended a synthmorph. Light metals and synthetic masking can effectively create a human-looking morph that would be light enough for flight (maybe even light enough for floating!). I suppose you could bulk out a morph by putting hollow air pockets within the musculature, but I don't know how safe that could be (plus, it would suck to take a wound and have your arm deflate). And while a keel certainly would improve efficiency, there are more subtle alternatives, such as if they make the sternum broad, but not extend as far out. Diamond-based bones would make it strong enough for the high-activity, but hold it closer to the body so that you don't need the broad bird chest. An X-ray examination would reveal a beefy chest plate that may even completely eliminate the need for a rib cage (or at least make the ribs much smaller).

Madwand wrote:

My solution to this was a Steel morph with dragonfly-like wings that can be uncurled from storage in the torso, plus hidden ionic drives in the legs. The ionic drives are there for thrust, the wings are there to for a bit of extra thrust, control, and especially to stabilize the ionics. It's not clear this combination would work in 1g but if the ionics are powerful enough it should do fine. I also wish I knew a bit more about how ionic drives worked to know if they could really fit into a pair of human-sized legs. But the same could be asked of any cyberware I suppose.

Ionic drives are powerful enough, it's one of the modes of travel for the Reaper, the biggest morph in the core book. I actually liked the way you configured it. Combining the wings with an ionic drive is an interesting combination for providing atmospheric flight. However, those dragonfly wings are relatively small (they may be broad, but they are nearly paper-thin and made of light metals), so they could probably be stored away on your morph simply through retraction into the back. As a recommendation, you might want to replace those wings with a thrust vector system, which allows for flight even within the vacuum of space, so long as your shell has some sort of air reserve tank to power it (I think that thrust vector comes stock with its own supply tank, but you can always have spares installed). Of course these wings would not be retractable, and would probably sit externally at all times.

So I hope this community doesn't have any sort of taboo against 'necro-posting', because this would probably count. Anyways, I was reading the EP books and saw the Lunar Flier (and the associated wings), and thought it was awesome. I'd love to have a winged flying morph who otherwise appeared primarily human, but 0.2g as a max is crippling. Anyways, I looked over this thread and came up with a few ideas. Note that I am fairly ignorant regarding the topics of flight and human anatomy, and even more so regarding the application of the principles of flight to human anatomy. First off, the wings themselves: The wings depicted on the art of the lunar flier look far too skimpy for an adult-sized morph that can fly in 1g. What if the wings were substantially more robust, and had a far larger anchoring area? Basically, start at the area to the inside of the shoulder blades, and move down and out to about the level of the sternum (at which point you should be just starting to come around the side of the torso). Alternatively, extend this all the way to the base of the rib cage. The wings should ideally be anchored both on the front and back of the torso. Edit for a note: While human blood also carries nutrients, you could probably get the respirocytes, medichines, or something similar to do that job. In replacing blood with nanobots that are likely far lighter, you are likely saving somewhere around ten pounds of weight, maybe more. Entirely removing the heart under the assumption that nanobots are self-propelled would save more weight, and the lungs could be expanded into the empty space. Skeleton: A lighter skeleton has been mentioned, and so has the total replacement of blood with nanomachines. I'd go with both of these for sure. The skeleton itself could either be diamond, or possibly hollow titanium, fluted for stiffness. Other, futuristic materials are of course options. Replace the blood with nanomachines, respirocytes, medichines, and nanophages. I think this would replicate the function of human blood, and then some. Hey, maybe toss in some skinlink-like bots just because; now your implants can talk to each other through your blood, rather than through the wireless mesh or via hardlines. In the process of replacing the skeleton, you could probably remove the necessity for a keel; rather than individual ribs, have a single solid piece that is sculpted to externally look and feel like a rib cage. A two part construction to allow for flexing might be possible or even probable. Lungs: Either modify them extensively, or replace them with some sort of constant air flow system. Any space that can be saved could be used for the restructuring of musculature to better fit wings while keeping as close to the form factor of a standard human. Musculature: As noted, the wings would require substantial musculature on the back, and possible some on the front of the chest. It might be desirable to provide stronger leg muscles, optimized for jumping, in order to provide a boost to takeoff. As for lightening the musculature of the body, I'm not really sure. Try replacing the structural components (tendons, ligaments) with artificial ones. Keep the muscle mass to a minimum - toned, rather than built. A lot of weight is water; it should be relatively trivial for Eclipse Phase tech to keep down the water weight in the muscles. Energy: Robust, powerful wings are going to require a lot of energy. Thankfully, we can probably borrow the Personal Power Plant implant from Gatecrashing, except that rather than an alternative source of energy, the morph requires it's output in addition to the energy gained from consumption of food in order to support the requirements of the wings. The morph might even possess the Fast Metabolism trait in addition to requiring the support of the Personal Power Plant implant, which would merely provide the 'upkeep' for the wings, while the Fast Metabolism trait would be required to provide the energy to actually use them. Edit for a few notes: While human blood also carries nutrients, you could probably use the respirocytes, medichines, or other similar nanobots to carry out that task. In the process of replacing human blood with the likely far-lighter nanobots, you'd probably save about 10 pounds. In addition, under the assumption that the nanobots are self-propelled, you could remove or significantly shrink the human heart, and expand the lungs (or their replacement) into the empty space, likely saving a significant amount of weight.

Here's a quick approximate formula for 'reality'. Obviously, GM's can over rule. If: Minimum Air Density * Maximum Gravity / Target Gravity > Target Air Density Then you can fly. If not, look at gliding. If you're at less than 1/2 the Target Air Density (or other fraction set by the GM), then you can't glide either, or you need to be going REALLY fast (like a human in a squirrel suit 'glides'). If you're at a significant multiple of the Target Air Density, you start swimming, ie you can make really sharp turns, can hover (like a dragon fly or bee), but slow down a bit, and look like a penguin when it 'flies' in water when moving in particularly dense fluids. (Yes, morphs with wings can also swim really well.) Engineering: The biggest problem with heavy objects flying is scaling: To carry double the weight, you need to double the wing's surface area in the same atmosphere at the same speed. However, doubling the wing area typically more than doubles the weight of the wing (think of the strength you need to hold a weight out at arm's length vs. right beside you). This can be offset by increasing your stall speed (the slowest you can go before you begin to fall) which is at least a square relation (weight increase = stall speed increase x stall speed increase) which is why airplanes can fly even though their wings are so 'small' when compared to their weight. This takes a lot more energy though, because the drag on the morph is also at least a square relation. -Joe

Decivre wrote:

Here are a few added suggestions [snip]

All good ideas. I would also recommend a cyberbrain; that single large chip would weigh a lot less than an organic brain and be more energy efficient, to boot. I have a morph design -- for a cyberbrain-equipped morph designed for flight in Martian gravity -- that I'll be posting in the "Homebrew" section when it's done.