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Lacking of Synth characters in sample Characters (core, sunward, quick start and npc prime 1)?

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nikleonard nikleonard's picture
Lacking of Synth characters in sample Characters (core, sunward, quick start and npc prime 1)?
I'm wondering, why there's only one Synth Synthmorph sample character in all the manuals i've readed (core, sunward, quick start and prime 1), and there's a lot of bouncers, ghosts and rusters?. I know that being a Synth had the "clanking masses" issue (especially on Luna), but, with synth skin, you can take advantage of the myriad of robotic enhancements for building an interesting character, without having the problem of everyone pointing at you. Maybe there's other sample character in bump in the night?
Playing Eclipse Phase the "Chilean Way"...
CodeBreaker CodeBreaker's picture
Re: Lacking of Synth characters in sample Characters (core, ...
Outside of the quickstart rules each Morph has, so far, gotten a single Sample Character to go along with it. Ghosts get a single Sample Character (Oversight Auditor), Rusters technically don't have one (The two in the quickstart rules are not 1000CP characters as far as I can tell, and shouldn't really be used outside of the quickstart adventure) and Bouncers get one as well (Anarchist Techie), two if you include the Brinker Security Specialist in the quickstart. I think it has been done this way on purpose, and that the Devs are trying to give anyone who wants to play a Sample Character as many options as possible. Sure, they could dedicate more to Synths (the morph itself, not Synthetic morphs in general) but why would they? Synthetics make up a smaller percentage of the population in most of the system, they are generally the morph of choice for people who cannot afford a biomorph (I.e not people doing super secret spy work for Firewall) and it would mean that one of the morphs that still doesn’t have a Sample Character would still not have one. If instead you are asking why there are not more Synthetic morphs, then I cannot see how. There is actually a fairly even spread. In Core you have 11 biomorphs and 4 synthetics. In Sunward you have 5 biomorphs (The Suyra doesn't count, you can hardly use it in an actual game) and 5 synthetics. So 16/9 is not that bad.
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nikleonard nikleonard's picture
Re: Lacking of Synth characters in sample Characters (core, ...
The two Rusters in the quickstart are not 1000CP Characters?. Well, The NPC Prime 1 characters are not supposed to be playable characters anyway (it's called NPC for something), and, if I take that out of the consideration, well, there's a fairly even spread of roughly 1 sample character per type (and that's good enough). The thing i've missed was a steel liberators adherant that was not a case morph, but one of the new types of morphs showcased in Sunward. But I see your point (in the way that the Quickstart and NPC Prime one characters are really not sample characters for players). Maybe, simply one can state that Synthmorphs are very uncommon, except for Cases in indentured service or super-high end completely non-humanoid models like the Reaper, or the Arachnoid.
Playing Eclipse Phase the "Chilean Way"...
CodeBreaker CodeBreaker's picture
Re: Lacking of Synth characters in sample Characters (core, ...
nikleonard wrote:
But I see your point (in the way that the Quickstart and NPC Prime one characters are really not sample characters for players). Maybe, simply one can state that Synthmorphs are very uncommon, except for Cases in indentured service or super-high end completely non-humanoid models like the Reaper, or the Arachnoid.
I wouldn't go that far. Its just that the Developers probably ran out of page space and couldn’t fit any of the other Morphs in. I am fairly sure if they hard their way (i.e unlimited page space and numbers, and they didn't have to worry about money) they would of included a Sample Character for each of the Morphs. But that isn't how it works unfortunately.
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nikleonard nikleonard's picture
Re: Lacking of Synth characters in sample Characters (core, ...
Maybe the correct statement will be "Uncommon as a Morph's choice for a Firewall sentinel", as you have pointed in one of the posts, even if a Synthmorph can actually be an advantage for a Sentinel (not a Case in any case, because the Lemon trait will screw you up in any mission, and Firewall will give you a better morph. Period).
Playing Eclipse Phase the "Chilean Way"...
Rhyx Rhyx's picture
Re: Lacking of Synth characters in sample Characters (core, ...
Maybe it simply has to do with the game universe aversion to synths: when someone has enough money to do so people will usually switch to a biomorph instead of a synth. From a completely practical point of view, any place that is hazardous to humans should be filled to the brim with Synths (no need for shelter, air, food you just need a plug and you are good to go.) but I think that the point is simply sentimentality on the part of the average Eclipse Phase ego. They come from biological forms and feel strange in anything but a biomorph. As it stands if it wasn't for the social stigma against synths I think that biomorphs would probably be extinct because there are just too many drawbacks to being biological (even if EP tones those drawbacks down quite a bit through superior technology.)
Decivre Decivre's picture
Re: Lacking of Synth characters in sample Characters (core, ...
Rhyx wrote:
Maybe it simply has to do with the game universe aversion to synths: when someone has enough money to do so people will usually switch to a biomorph instead of a synth. From a completely practical point of view, any place that is hazardous to humans should be filled to the brim with Synths (no need for shelter, air, food you just need a plug and you are good to go.) but I think that the point is simply sentimentality on the part of the average Eclipse Phase ego. They come from biological forms and feel strange in anything but a biomorph. As it stands if it wasn't for the social stigma against synths I think that biomorphs would probably be extinct because there are just too many drawbacks to being biological (even if EP tones those drawbacks down quite a bit through superior technology.)
I think it should be noted that there are many advantages to being biological as well. All living creatures are, in effect, self-producing self-repairing nanomachines. So long as we have the means to sustain ourselves (food, air and such), we also have the means to produce more of ourselves. Implants and modifications can go a long way to making us far less high-maintenance as well (if you do so through bioware, you may potentially pass it on to your offspring, lending to the advantages of being self-reproducing). There are plenty of advantages to purely synthetic bodies, but it isn't completely accurate to state that it is all advantages. There are certainly trade-offs, and not all of them are aesthetic in nature.
Transhumans will one day be the Luddites of the posthuman age. [url=http://bit.ly/2p3wk7c]Help me get my gaming fix, if you want.[/url]
CodeBreaker CodeBreaker's picture
Re: Lacking of Synth characters in sample Characters (core, ...
Yup. There are also all kinds of ego security concerns when you are sitting pretty in a synthetic morph. Viruses are much more dangerous to you, especially the malicious variety that like to entrap egos in their cyberbrains before driving them insane. It is also much, much easier to pull a fork of an ego from a synthetic morph than it is from a bio, you just have to break through their mesh inserts, smash your way past the cyberbrains firewall and you are set. A skilled hacker could pull a fork from any synthetic without the owner ever knowing. At least when you are in a biomorph you can be fairly sure that unless you have been knocked out and thrown into an ego bridge in the last little while you are safe. Plus, that social prejudice against synths exists for a reason. Ten years ago robots killed almost everyone, hell, they probably killed quite a few of the people living right now. I can see quite large percentage of the population never really getting over that fact. And because everyone basically lives forever now, that isn't going to just go away in a generation.
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nikleonard nikleonard's picture
Re: Lacking of Synth characters in sample Characters (core, ...
Decivre wrote:
There are plenty of advantages to purely synthetic bodies, but it isn't completely accurate to state that it is all advantages. There are certainly trade-offs, and not all of them are aesthetic in nature.
Some disadvantages of Synth bodies over Biological bodies: 1.- Maintenance. In EP, nanotechnology makes easy to build self-mantaining machines (as easy as put medichines in a Synth), but there are other issues with maintenance (nuclear power supplies and the such) that has to be taken in consideration. 2.- Lack of self reproduction, but in EP, building a SynthMorph is an easy task (except high-end custom models, but is more easy than building a Biomorph) 3.- Lack of some body features that transhuman egos are accustomed to (having sex by example), but Synth Skin adds some of that features. 4.- Tactile Precision. Synth bodies don't have the same degree of tactile precision of Biomorphs, but one can compensate with tools and upgrades. 5.- Cyberbrains are hackable. That's the greatest disadvantage of being a Synthmorph or a Pod. 6.- Social Stigma, associated of Synthmorphs being lazy, poor, or propense to TITAN hacking, and the bioconservationist movement. 7.- (Game Rules) A lot of traits are not available to Synthmorphs, included Psi. 8.- (Game Rules) Restricted selection of bioware mods. 9.- Cheap Synthmorphs come with the lemon trait. (But some biomorphs come with the planned obsolescence trait). 10.- The Uncanny Valley trait (only in Androids/Gynoids, but eliminable with Synth Skin). Some advantages of being a Synth: 1.- They not needs to breathing, eating or sleeping. (but loses the pleasure of eating, or having a nice dream) 2.- More resistant to damage and pain. 3.- Inmunity to Psi Sleights of level 1-2. 4.- Robotic Mods. One can have some of them in a biomorph, but only with Cybernetic Limbs. 5.- Inmunity to diseases, toxins, low/high temperatures, vacuum, and some attacks. 6.- Fast building and resleeving. 7.- Cheaper than a equally capable Biomorph. As every thing, being a SynthMorph has a lot of advantages and disadvantages. The important thing is the morph serves the purpose to the player (or NPC). For me, a Synth with a lot of upgrades and Synth Skin are very useful, but a Bouncer or a Ghost will not be a bad option.
Playing Eclipse Phase the "Chilean Way"...
Decivre Decivre's picture
Re: Lacking of Synth characters in sample Characters (core, ...
nikleonard wrote:
Some advantages of being a Synth: 2.- More resistant to damage and pain.
There are biomorph implants that can mitigate this, as well as traits like high pain tolerance. A biomorph is capable of being as resilient to pain as a synthmorph. The only disadvantage that would remain potentially is resistance to damage, of which a synthmorph is still decidedly moreso.
nikleonard wrote:
3.- Inmunity to Psi Sleights of level 1-2.
For now. This seems to actually be asymptomatic of the fact that they cannot use psi. Theoretically, should we come up with the technology to have synthmorphs with psi, they will also be vulnerable to it. Psi ends up being a synthmorph's double-edged blade.
nikleonard wrote:
5.- Inmunity to diseases, toxins, low/high temperatures, vacuum, and some attacks.
Any biomorph with basic biomods is immune to disease; with toxin filters immune to toxins; with temperature tolerance immune to a wider range of temperatures (neither synth- nor biomorphs are immune to ALL temperatures); and with vacuum sealing immune to vacuum. There are bio-organic means to get most of these immunities.
nikleonard wrote:
7.- Cheaper than a equally capable Biomorph.
Sex can be free, and it makes biomorphs. I'm just saying.... :D
Transhumans will one day be the Luddites of the posthuman age. [url=http://bit.ly/2p3wk7c]Help me get my gaming fix, if you want.[/url]
nikleonard nikleonard's picture
Re: Lacking of Synth characters in sample Characters (core, ...
Decivre wrote:
nikleonard wrote:
7.- Cheaper than a equally capable Biomorph.
Sex can be free, and it makes biomorphs. I'm just saying.... :D
I've nearly died of laugh on this one XD But remember, some biomorphs are sterile, and the pregnancy, delivery and rising the child to adulthood are not free. In the Psi inmunity trait, well, I think its like a consolation prize for having hackable cyberbrains, and biomorphs can do with implants and mods nearly everything a Synthmorph can do, but the same works in reverse. Biological Science appears to be more advanced than Robotics in Eclipse Phase, but both are capable of increible feats. (But, in a side note, having a Pod is like having the disadvantages of both Synthmorphs and Biomorphs, and nearly none of the advantages...) At the end, the problem is that one changes Psi inmunity for Hacking inmunity, and Biomods for Robotic mods, and lose the option of getting a lot of traits but gain a lot of traits for "free".
Playing Eclipse Phase the "Chilean Way"...
Decivre Decivre's picture
Re: Lacking of Synth characters in sample Characters (core, ...
nikleonard wrote:
But remember, some biomorphs are sterile, and the pregnancy, delivery and rising the child to adulthood are not free. In the Psi inmunity trait, well, I think its like a consolation prize for having hackable cyberbrains, and biomorphs can do with implants and mods nearly everything a Synthmorph can do, but the same works in reverse. Biological Science appears to be more advanced than Robotics in Eclipse Phase, but both are capable of increible feats. (But, in a side note, having a Pod is like having the disadvantages of both Synthmorphs and Biomorphs, and nearly none of the advantages...) At the end, the problem is that one changes Psi inmunity for Hacking inmunity, and Biomods for Robotic mods, and lose the option of getting a lot of traits but gain a lot of traits for "free".
If technology has reached the point that gender is an easily-altered trait (it can be done in any healing vat), then fertility is just as easily altered. The only real issue is sexual compatibility... if a remade has 54 chromosomes, then it probably isn't compatible with a 46-chromosome flat. While raising an infant is certainly not free, it's probably a much less costly affair in the world of EP considering that basic amenities are free in most habitats... especially considering that you simultaneously create a new biomorph and ego.
Transhumans will one day be the Luddites of the posthuman age. [url=http://bit.ly/2p3wk7c]Help me get my gaming fix, if you want.[/url]
nikleonard nikleonard's picture
Re: Lacking of Synth characters in sample Characters (core, ...
The problem is two things: 1.- Time, and 2.- (and more important), you are not creating a Biomorph, you are creating a person (Ego + Morph). A person that will not be able to be a new body to an infugee or for yourself when you get killed or bored (or at least not ethically). Its a more powerful and important act, but it's certainly not the creation of a Biomorph.
Playing Eclipse Phase the "Chilean Way"...
Decivre Decivre's picture
Re: Lacking of Synth characters in sample Characters (core, ...
nikleonard wrote:
The problem is two things: 1.- Time, and 2.- (and more important), you not are creating a Biomorph, you are creating a person (Ego + Morph). A person that will not be able to be a new body to an infugee or for yourself when you get killed or bored (or at least not ethically). Its a more powerful and important act, but it's certainly not the creation of a Biomorph.
That depends. The manufacture of biomorphs by other means precludes the creation of an ego. This means that there is a way for someone to arrest the function of a brain that produces an ego, and therefore that a parent could theoretically choose whether or not they wish to give birth to a child or sleeve. Of course, there are significant issues that will arise when trying to create a sleeve in this manner (as you are effectively raising a comatose child with no mind), but the option is still there.
Transhumans will one day be the Luddites of the posthuman age. [url=http://bit.ly/2p3wk7c]Help me get my gaming fix, if you want.[/url]
CodeBreaker CodeBreaker's picture
Re: Lacking of Synth characters in sample Characters (core, ...
Decivre wrote:
That depends. The manufacture of biomorphs by other means precludes the creation of an ego. This means that there is a way for someone to arrest the function of a brain that produces an ego, and therefore that a parent could theoretically choose whether or not they wish to give birth to a child or sleeve. Of course, there are significant issues that will arise when trying to create a sleeve in this manner (as you are effectively raising a comatose child with no mind), but the option is still there.
No real reasons come to mind why someone would do that rather than just use an exowomb and force grow the BioMorph to maturity in three years though. Which is basically what growing a new BioMorph is anyway.
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Decivre Decivre's picture
Re: Lacking of Synth characters in sample Characters (core, ...
CodeBreaker wrote:
No real reasons come to mind why someone would do that rather than just use an exowomb and force grow the BioMorph to maturity in three years though. Which is basically what growing a new BioMorph is anyway.
Can't afford an exowomb would be my first guess, immediately followed by "because I wanted to make a biomorph the old-fashioned way" and finally "because making biomorphs this way is far more entertaining (at least in the short term)". In fact, reason #3 might give people incentives to create biomorph zygotes the old-fashioned way, then implant the "initialized product" into an exowomb afterwards. It's certainly a much better option if the wife wants to keep her figure.
Transhumans will one day be the Luddites of the posthuman age. [url=http://bit.ly/2p3wk7c]Help me get my gaming fix, if you want.[/url]