Welcome! These forums will be deactivated by the end of this year. The conversation continues in a new morph over on Discord! Please join us there for a more active conversation and the occasional opportunity to ask developers questions directly! Go to the PS+ Discord Server.

Ego Birthing

4 posts / 0 new
Last post
Duke Rollo Duke Rollo's picture
Ego Birthing
DISCLAIMER: Apologies if the issues I raise here have already been addressed in other threads. I try to do my best to look at what's been posted before I post, but I'm only a flat with no muse... so if this has already been beaten to death, go ahead and direct me to that thread. That being said, let's talk about having babies. (get your mind out of the gutter. This thread is rated PG-13) First, let's set aside the jovian republic and all the other places that are bioconservative. We'll just assume they're having babies the old fashioned way. Mostly. Second, why would transhumans have babies the old fashioned way? Sure, there will be some people in female morphs who want to "experience a life growing inside them" but I think most people would agree that pregnancy is a pain in the ass. In fact, it's a pain in a variety of interesting places. Consider also that in the age of morph brokerage, telling a broker that you had a kid would likely devalue the morph for a variety of reasons I'd rather not get into. That being said, I came up with the idea of ego-birthing. It wouldd go something like this. Two individuals decide they wish to have an offspring. They could be of opposite gender or the same gender. They would seek the assistance of a lab that specializes in this process... basically a place that can do really high tech cloning and psyche surgery. Using specialized equipment, each parent creates a a specialized alpha fork. This fork isn't fully aware... it's a set of ones and zeros on a computer lying dormant. Each parent then decides which traits they wish the offspring to possess. The father's sense of adventure. The mother's sense of humor. The father's creativity. The mother's ability to focus on tasks. Both dormant forks are then wiped of memories and merged together. This new ego (the offspring) will possess the personality traits the parents selected. This new ego then would be awakened in specialized simulspace nursery where the parents can interact with it in an idealized environment. Note that "idealized" is left up the parents. For example, if the parents are professional Gatecrashers, the simulspace might be a series of imagined alien worlds. If the parents are fearing for the safety of their child, the simulspace might be a sort of boot ccamp to help them deal with the real world. Or it might be a fantasy world to give the kid the magical childhood the parents never had. The point is that the new ego is nurtured by the two parents who interact with it via VR. While the ego is being raised by the parents, the same lab that created the new ego is busy creating a clone morph that is a hybrid of both parents DNA. Or not. That's just one option. If one parent is an infomorph whose body never made it off Earth, maybe the offspring's morph will be a clone of just one of the parents. Maybe the parents aren't the same species (a transhuman and an uplift for example. Don't laugh. How many women love dolphins?) and the parents have to decide which species the offspring will be. Eventually, the new offspring is sleaved into the morph and goes out into the world. Now, consider carefully the possibilities here. Think about how modern human beings have to raise their kids. There is a brief window of time when children and adults are both able to participate in things together as adults. Consider a person who has a child at 20. It takes 20 years for the offspring to catch up to where the parent is. There is a time when the child is 20 and the parent is 40... starting to be over the hill but still young enough to do some things. Basically, we wait years to be able to carry on a real conversation with our offspring and by the time they really know who they are, we're old. Why settle for that? If you're into gatecrashing and so is the love of your life, why not create an offspring with them that's up to speed in say... two years? Or the time it takes to grow a clone? Imagine getting to spend your 20's WITH your child rather than just having to tell them stories about "back in your time". This isn't some Futura lost generation waiting to happen. This is you and the person you love combined and there with you. Immortal and forever. I'm eager to hear your feedback & thoughts.
-Duke Rollo
King Shere King Shere's picture
Re: Ego Birthing
Duke Rollo wrote:
DISCLAIMER: Apologies if the issues I raise here have already been addressed in other threads. I try to do my best to look at what's been posted before I post, but I'm only a flat with no muse... so if this has already been beaten to death, go ahead and direct me to that thread.
Here is a couple of the numerous threads dealing with that worn topic, 56 search results using the EP forums internal search (not all of them in the topic though.) http://www.eclipsephase.com/morphs-and-having-children http://www.eclipsephase.com/childrens-brains-egos http://www.eclipsephase.com/family-matter http://www.eclipsephase.com/reproduction-age-transhumanity http://www.eclipsephase.com/evolution-vs-iterative-development http://www.eclipsephase.com/lost-part-2 http://www.eclipsephase.com/mommy-daddy-where-do-babies-come-real-ep-que...
Arenamontanus Arenamontanus's picture
Re: Ego Birthing
I think the main reason this subject comes up again and again is that a truly trans/posthuman world is hard to imagine. Family life and reproduction are very fundamental to many people, and imagining a world where it has changed profoundly may be tricky. I have just spent a few days at a family event surrounding grandmother's centenary, and comparing it to what something similar in EP would be like shows some jarring differences. Most relatives would of course be dead in the Fall. Among the survivors, there would be more generations present but fewer people per generation (a "beanpole family"). There would be more inter-family links due to a long series of past marriages, some of which ended cordially. There would possibly be a bundle of forks present, both divergent alphas but also remaining betas and gammas of dead family members (opening the family album gets a new meaning when there are forks in it). And it is not impossible that some families would have many adopted members, from Fall orphans to AGIs and uplift families that have grown up as foster-members. I would guess one of the things that splits families in EP is radical choices in biology and rearing. Sure, holding firm religious or ideological beliefs can be annoying, but the really disruptive thing is lifestyles that are experienced as outrageous. Aunt Rose might be annoying with her fundamentalist evangelism and hyperevolutionism, but uncle Chang, living with a harem of slightly edited forks of himself, is much more creepy. And cousin Li, rearing children and AGIs almost on a factory basis in simulspace to fit her current interests, she is definitely the black sheep of the family... Oh, we don't talk about granduncle Stephen who switched species.
Extropian
The Doctor The Doctor's picture
Re: Ego Birthing
Arenamontanus wrote:
And it is not impossible that some families would have many adopted members, from Fall orphans to AGIs and uplift families that have grown up as foster-members.
There is also the question of chosen family as opposed to biological family. People who choose their family as opposed to consider their bloodlines family are rare but on the upswing. One wonders what that would lead to in a few thousand years...
Arenamontanus wrote:
Oh, we don't talk about granduncle Stephen who switched species.
"I never thought someone would want to sleeve into a hamster with a cyberbrain before that family reunion..."