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Question about enhanced vision

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Noble Pigeon Noble Pigeon's picture
Question about enhanced vision
So on page 301 in the core book, enhanced vision is described as being able to see the electromagnetic spectrum from terahertz to gamma rays. Now I'm not well versed in things like electromagnetism or any of that scientific mumbo jumbo, so what exactly does that mean? As a GM I'm not exactly used to games where players have cheap access to things like being able to see in x-ray vision all the time, so I'm not quite sure how to handle situations like this since I'm much more interested in telling a compelling story rather than have to accommodate for the pinpoint scientific accuracy of the result of almost everyone being able to see things beyond the normal visual spectrum.
"Don't believe everything you read on the Internet.” -Abraham Lincoln, State of the Union address
DivineWrath DivineWrath's picture
Have you read the sections on
Have you read the sections on p. 302 and p. 303? (They are literally on the next pages over) They cover what different types of visions and hearing can do. For instance, infrared vision is heat vision and can also be used to do chemistry tests to determine what substance is composed of. Beyond that, I have to think. I know that some kinds of cloaking technology, like chameleon skin and invisibility cloak, can be beaten if you have the right sensors.
Noble Pigeon Noble Pigeon's picture
Yeah, I've read them, but I
Yeah, I've read them, but I still don't know what exactly Enhanced vision gives you since all it says is "being able to see the electromagnetic spectrum from terahertz to gamma rays", and I have no idea what that entails.
"Don't believe everything you read on the Internet.” -Abraham Lincoln, State of the Union address
UnitOmega UnitOmega's picture
Well, you'd probably have
Well, you'd probably have gotten a lot cleaner answer if you'd just looked up the EM spectrum and what it contains, but, since you asked, the EM spectrum goes from Gamma rays with the highest frequency and smallest wavelength, all the way down though a big long list of Radio wave frequencies which don't matter because Enhanced only goes into the THz range. Enhanced Vision lets you see, as regular humans can see visible light: Gamma Rays, X-Rays, Ultraviolet, Visible, Infrared and then the T-Ray band. For practical purposes, though, you can mostly ignore the Gamma, X and T rays, unless people also pick up emitters for those, since they don't naturally occur very often unless you're looking in the right spots in space. If they do have emitters, this just allows them to basically perform an X-Ray or T-Ray scan like they were at an airport or doctor's office, only they can do it without any special imaging equipment, they only need their eyes. Also you can see in several dozen colors.
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ORCACommander ORCACommander's picture
and the enhanced part is not
and the enhanced part is not necessarily all encompassing. they may just have 1 or 2 extra spectrums covered.
DivineWrath DivineWrath's picture
I think the OP is asking,
I think the OP is asking, what impact on the setting would Enhanced Vision have? As in, he is asking it in much same way one might ask what impact did the discovery of electricity have, the industrial revolution, landing on the moon, the development of nuclear physics, or the ability to transplant organs. I don't know of many examples off hand of how seeing in many more spectrums than normal impacts a story. The only thing I can think of right now is Geordi La Forge from Star Trek: The Next Generation. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geordi_La_Forge
Jaberwo Jaberwo's picture
I picture it as giving a lot
I picture it as giving a lot of things that are invisible a color and making a lot of things transparent that appeared solid before. You can see all kinds of IR colored smoke and mist everywhere, dense or dilute, with the color telling you what kind of chemical it is if you are familiar with it. If not your muse or an AR program can tell you. This way you can tell if food is spoiled, see when someone farts, and won't walk into a cloud of toxic gas. People may wear clothing that appears bland in the visible range but in fact has UV, IR or even X-ray colors and patterns, with the latter only appearing when you step into those slighly dangerous X-ray lights in your local club. The hotter new club around the corner has T-ray lights though, so everyone seems to wear transparent clothing... It's never dark, instead you can always see the glow of infrared from warm objects, people leave footprints on the cold floor. You can see the temperature from afar, e.g. offering somone your gloves because their hands change color in IR way before they turn blue. Blushing is not very visible with everyone in the optical spectrum but almost everyone blushes in IR. You might even see the water vapor peple give off when they sweat. Solar weather is as visible as a thunderstorm, probably even inside a habitat.
Axel the Chimeric Axel the Chimeric's picture
Noble Pigeon wrote:As a GM I
Noble Pigeon wrote:
As a GM I'm not exactly used to games where players have cheap access to things like being able to see in x-ray vision all the time, so I'm not quite sure how to handle situations like this since I'm much more interested in telling a compelling story rather than have to accommodate for the pinpoint scientific accuracy of the result of almost everyone being able to see things beyond the normal visual spectrum.
I would direct you to look at Panopticon's gear section and the relevant mentions of sensory filters so that biomorphs can choose which spectra to observe at a given time, because this is important. I think I can sum up what I'm about to say as "Sh*t be bright, yo!", but I'll offer some more eloquence. When you look at the various spectra, there's a hell of a lot of information there that's not exactly easily interpreted on top of the various other spectra. For example, UV light is bright. Really, really bright. You can't really focus on it AND visible light at the same time. In fact, areas with high amounts of UV light might just outright blind you to slightly more mundane details; it could effectively render you colourblind or even blind outright. Meanwhile, IR is much lower on the spectrum. It's dark. It's just as hard to focus on that and the visible spectra as it is to see the stars in the city, for much the same reasons. Everything that's said about UV, apply double to higher ends of the spectrum. T-Rays, meanwhile, can't emit constantly because then you're a walking radiation hazard. Similarly, it pings your enemy with your position if they have a radiation scanner or T-Ray detector of their own. Short version: There's a hell of a lot to see and you can only focus on a small fraction at once. Players have access to a big tool-kit with enhanced vision - it allows for chemical analysis, seeing through walls, not being affected by darkness, etc. - but it's very much a double-edged sword. You can't be scanning every spectrum all the time without risking major sensory overload. You can't be looking through walls constantly because you'll get arrested (if you're lucky). Whatever spectrum you ARE looking into has its advantages and disadvantages. And, always remember, their enemies have cheap access to this too; they can track by the heat of footprints, spot their T-Ray projector, etc.
ORCACommander ORCACommander's picture
oh fun fact direct infrared
oh fun fact direct infrared is more harmful to retinal tissue than ultraviolet.
Shunka Shunka's picture
Another note: T-ray vision is
Another note: T-ray vision is listed somewhere in the core rules as only penetrating a certain amount of AR/Durability barrier. If you go the page in the combat section which lists the AR and Dur of various structural materials you will find that T-ray vision basically lets you look through the Transhuman equivalent of drywall, but serious flooring or ceilings will probably stop it, as will any sort of armored building. I also tend to play it as 'you can see through it, but it degrades your vision'. In other words, T-rays are great for checking out what knicknacks someone has in their pockets but if you do try looking through walls things will be very blurry...Not unlike looking at something through so many sheets of gauze that you're having trouble seeing through them. The closer the structural numbers get to the T-ray limit, the more I tend to 'obscure' detail. It also bears mentioning that X-ray or T-ray 'views' as we are used to seeing them are shadows cast by the X-rays or T-rays. If you're trying to see based on reflective capability, with the emitter something you are holding and pointing at a distant object, then I would liken that to trying to find a white car in dense fog using a flashlight...As opposed to perceiving the silhouette of said car if the light were on the far side of it. Superman-vision it ain't. Not at those prices. I don't do this to handicap the players...I do this to handicap the NPCs. Because otherwise the players would constantly be doing things using 20th c. estimations of visibility that would be 'in plain sight' to wide-band vision capable surveillance.
ThatWhichNeverWas ThatWhichNeverWas's picture
I see all the things!
I disagree with Axel the Chimeric; I doubt the relative luminescence of different wavelengths would be too great an issue, as the vision is an artificial construct, meaning that the level of sensitivity is artificially defined - it would be a badly designed augment otherwise. I understand it as has been already mentioned - you see more colours, and most things are at least partially translucent to some of those new colours. So if you're looking at a person, you could see the shadows of their bones, the glowing lines of their blood vessels, maybe the vague suggestions of their organs, all wrapped in frosted glass skin swathed in swirls of colour. Similarly, in thin walls you may be able to see power conduits or piping as though it was made of smoked glass, but most walls will be largely impenetrable simply because that's what walls are for. (For the same reason, most clothes... or at least underwear... will either reflect or absorb certain wavelengths.) So, everything looks shockingly beautiful, if somewhat disturbing at times. One thing to remember is that just because you can see something doesn't mean that you know what it is. A daitya may be equipped with an internal plasma cannon, but all someone with enhanced vision could see is a mess of barely perceptible metal edges connected to a pretty spinny light-torus, if they can see anything at all through the armour. This page might be of use.
In the past we've had to compensate for weaknesses, finding quick solutions that only benefit a few. But what if we never need to feel weak or morally conflicted again?
ORCACommander ORCACommander's picture
I play an engineer in Space
I play an engineer in Space station 13 nd i use t-ray emitters quite frequently to trace power conduits and atmos pipes. can be fairly useful in finding the telltale heart :P
Jaberwo Jaberwo's picture
Axel, you mentioned that T
Axel, you mentioned that T-rays involve a radiation hazard. Did you mean X-rays or are T-Rays more dangerous than I knew?
Smokeskin Smokeskin's picture
Shunka wrote:Another note: T
Shunka wrote:
Another note: T-ray vision is listed somewhere in the core rules as only penetrating a certain amount of AR/Durability barrier. If you go the page in the combat section which lists the AR and Dur of various structural materials you will find that T-ray vision basically lets you look through the Transhuman equivalent of drywall, but serious flooring or ceilings will probably stop it, as will any sort of armored building.
Any amount of metal or water will also block t-rays. I'm guessing that in the future, everyone is using tinfoil against surveillance.
Axel the Chimeric Axel the Chimeric's picture
ThatWhichNeverWas wrote:I
ThatWhichNeverWas wrote:
I disagree with Axel the Chimeric; I doubt the relative luminescence of different wavelengths would be too great an issue, as the vision is an artificial construct, meaning that the level of sensitivity is artificially defined - it would be a badly designed augment otherwise.
If you are using bioware, it would seem likely to me that it would be an issue simply because it's a function of biological eyes now. With cyberware, the case may be greatly eased but that doesn't really change the issue of sensory overload. The various spectra of light we're used to seeing would inevitably overlay each other and drown each other out. For comparison, I suggest taking a map, and then taking a transparency of the same map but with completely different details and laying it over-top, and then doing this a handful more times. You even bring it up a bit in your own post. If you can see all the blood vessels in someone's face, the various colours of the IR spectrum that show where heat is moving, the reflection of different types of light in the UV spectrum, and perhaps even filter out the different kinds of polarization in all of the above, potentially combined with the view of their skull if you have T-Ray vision... That person won't look remotely like a human being you're used to. All that detail will make other details, like facial tics, potentially harder to notice.
Jaberwo wrote:
Axel, you mentioned that T-rays involve a radiation hazard. Did you mean X-rays or are T-Rays more dangerous than I knew?
I think I may simply have been misinformed. Some T-Rays are actually even within the IR band. Not exactly hazardous.
ORCACommander ORCACommander's picture
actually the human mind is
actually the human mind is already greatly adept at obscuring detail and consolidating data. unless we focus on something our eyes deliberately blur out what is not relevant. Also an excellent example of the mind bluring things together is your monitor. the orange in your exhuman sig is not actually orange. it is a combination of various blues, greens and reds. at normal viewing distance the mind combines these into color orange. I'd imagine with a new array of always on spectra the mind would do additional consolidation there. Hell most light toned people already have partly translucent skin but you have to be close and focus on it to notice it.
Ikky Ikky's picture
Derail!
ORCACommander wrote:
I play an engineer in Space station 13 nd i use t-ray emitters quite frequently to trace power conduits and atmos pipes. can be fairly useful in finding the telltale heart :P
,..Server?
ORCACommander ORCACommander's picture
Mostly on /TG/Sybil
Mostly on /TG/Sybil
Ikky Ikky's picture
Bay
I'm a Bay-babby, you know. That server the others hate.
Erulastant Erulastant's picture
A good way to deal with
A good way to deal with unfiltered enhanced vision is with color blending. Sure you can detect UV light, but can you separate that from the other light you're seeing? If something is reflecting green light and red light, you're not going to see green and red, you're going to see something yellowish brownish. So if something's reflecting UV and, say, blue, you might not be able to separate the colors.
You, too, were made by humans. The methods used were just cruder, imprecise. I guess that explains a lot.
UnitOmega UnitOmega's picture
This is why Sense Filters are
This is why Sense Filters are important. Personally, while obviously if they don't overlap you can see amazing new things (hence the +20 to visual perception, though some of that is also for the 5x magnification) I assume Enhanced Vision just kinds of blurs together when looking at most things. You may see things which fluoresce only with UV light, and many objects may seem to glow faintly in the IR, but unless you're in a filtered environment, it probably just all resonates together as part of the whole "spectrum of dozens of colors" deal.
H-Rep: An EP Homebrew Blog http://ephrep.blogspot.com/
ORCACommander ORCACommander's picture
I feel Like i must add this now
ThatWhichNeverWas ThatWhichNeverWas's picture
My Eyes Are Ready.
Axel the Chimeric wrote:
If you are using bioware, it would seem likely to me that it would be an issue simply because it's a function of biological eyes now.
Yes and no. Our eyes have evolved to work well with the amount of light we usually experience. UV may be “brighter”, but that can be compensated for by having the receptors be less dense in comparison, or require more stimulus to fire. Likewise, you could make IR receptors more sensitive or denser. There are other mechanisms you could use, but those are the simplest I can come up with of the top of my head. Secondly, as ORCACommander and Erulastant have mentioned, the eye and brain are really good at weaving disparate information together to a cohesive whole. Think less laying maps over aone another, more a picture with only red elements, then a picture with only blue elements, then a picture with only red elements, then green... Yes, you may loose some detail (although that's more to do with how the brain managed incoming information than the visual system itself – see the Oracle implant or Panopticon software), but not as much as you seem to think; a visual tick would be just as, if not more visible, because it would alter how the blood vessels are positioned, the density of the skin and so it's translucency and so forth.
ORCACommander wrote:
http://theoatmeal.com/comics/mantis_shrimp
Ah yes, the Mantis Shrimp, the Exsurgent of the Ocean. Seriously, they can see everything, are armoured, and have a built in death ray. Sounds like a genetically engineered alien killing machine to me!
In the past we've had to compensate for weaknesses, finding quick solutions that only benefit a few. But what if we never need to feel weak or morally conflicted again?
Smokeskin Smokeskin's picture
It's amazing what you can
It's amazing what you can build with just one-dimensional amino acid chains held together by weak van der Waals forces.
Jaberwo Jaberwo's picture
And disulfide bridges!
And disulfide bridges!
UnitOmega UnitOmega's picture
I believe this video is relevant to this discussion
H-Rep: An EP Homebrew Blog http://ephrep.blogspot.com/