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programing nanites/microbots dirty tricks and dont get it...

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Baalbamoth Baalbamoth's picture
programing nanites/microbots dirty tricks and dont get it...
ok so nanites are only produced in hives, and they are produced with pre-set programing that can only be altered in minor ways (like being told only attack go-nin corp synthmorps), to change programing a new batch of nanites needs to be produced which takes hours (is this correct?) they specifically cannot self-replicate (though proteans could be set to create hives so?!?) Micro-drones and "master microbots" in smart swarms seem to get around the inability to be reprogramed by having distributed egos, but the non-master microbots cannot be farther than 50 meters from the center swarm or must be AI piloted or jammed. so what limits are there to the programing of nanites? could you program nanite swarms to follow or stick to smart swarms, if so... how many? no limit? nanites seem to do 1d10/2 damage per round to just about anything except organics, though I am assuming a black market nanite to do exactly that would be fairly easy for anyone with nanite programing to do exactly that. what stops a programmer from programing nanites to say "start pulling pins on grenades" could microdrones carry small amounts of thermite and be programed to "find the reactor containment room and melt the computers" I'm just kind of struggling with getting my head around what you can and cannot do with nanites/smart swarms/microdrones/microbots. and if anybody has dirty tricks you can do with nanites... love to hear em...
"what do I want? The usual — hundreds of grandchildren, complete dominion over the known worlds, and the pleasure of hearing that all my enemies have died in highly improbable accidents that cannot be connected to me."
Hapax Legomenon Hapax Legomenon's picture
Sure you can reprogram
Sure you can reprogram nanites on-the-fly. There's no hard numbers on how long it takes to produce nanites, but the buzzer mentions that an attached specialized nanohive can produce another hive in an hour. And you can set them to damage organics. They're not necessarily the most efficient way to hurt people (that's what bullets are for), but there's no reason you can't. The only thing that keeps them from pulling grenade pins is that they're too small to do so quickly enough. Microdrones are TINY. Width-of-a-human-hair tiny. Yeah you could load nanites or microbots with explosive - Arenamontanus's website has an idea for a swarm loaded with explosives that can act as a super-thermobaric bomb, which is an awesome idea. You could also have them amass into a smallish bomb. Presumably with enough skill you could program them into a shaped charge that could do an awful lot of damage. The problem I see is programming them to seek out the reactor - I'm not sure how smart Nanites can be as far as 'go find x'. The other problem is they move SLOWLY because of their small size. You pretty much have to release them in the same room as the target or it's going to take forever to get where they're going. The hard answer is you can do basically anything with nanobots. The only real limiting force is that they can do anything incredibly slowly. They can do anything, but they're always the least efficient method. An idea I had is a teddy bear loaded with several gas grenades to spray nanoswarms to protect a little girl. One injector swarm programmed to inject everyone within 20 yards except the little girl with Nervex (and to constantly reinject anyone who has medichines), one disassembler swarm to eat everyone within 20 yards except the little girl, and a protean swarm to use the disassembled remains of all the people nearby and whatever else they need to build an armored survival pod for the little girl. Somebody with multitasking or mental speed augs could specially program a swarm in the first round of combat, toss a splash grenade loaded with said swarm at the bad guys, and then join in the fight. Engineer swarms could weaken the floor or walls (SLOWLY, but it could count); disassemblers could eat their armor and then their faces; injectors could, well, inject them with whatever terrible shit you can imagine; saboteurs could break their robots and whatever electronics they were using; basically you can do whatever you want (and whatever your Programming skill and their very slow speed will allow). Proteans are really only useful if you absolutely can't get your hands on a fabber or CM, which is pretty rare. And you can't make a self-replicating nanoswarm, but you can buy a generalized hive loaded with blueprints for whatever swarms you want, bolt a nuclear battery or solar recharger to it and let it go. Hives and fabbers come with a built in 'Seymour' hive (at least that's what I'm going to call it since I had the idea 2 1/2 minutes ago) solely to keep them fed with what they need to make new hives. Hell, bolt the whole thing to a robomule with a satellite receiver and you've got every precautionists's nightmare. A mobile, theoretically controllable source of near-infinite nanoswarms. Even on its own, the thing could eventually re-sculpt an entire planet.
Baalbamoth Baalbamoth's picture
heh
lol love teddy, though think you should start the whole shebang off with a few EMP grenades, ya know to take out those cleaners, synths, and defensive nanites before you open the faraday and release the swarms. about the grenade pins, if a smart swarm can form a whole synthmorph it would be MUCH more easy to grasp each other like army ants and form a little nanite tentacle to pull the pin. having micro tools alone should probably allow that. heck to pull all the pins, hammer all the live rounds, set off little thermite charges in the charger packs and other fuel or explosive sources all coordinated to go off on the same action assuming they had time to position without detection... that would be a hell of a big bang... what about nanites that build an additional puppet sock in every hab cleaning bot then start making explosives and chemical agents from cleaning supplies and storing them in the bot... why cant proteans make hives?
"what do I want? The usual — hundreds of grandchildren, complete dominion over the known worlds, and the pleasure of hearing that all my enemies have died in highly improbable accidents that cannot be connected to me."
Hapax Legomenon Hapax Legomenon's picture
Proteans probably can make
Proteans probably can make hives. Both the hives and the swarms will need a power source (so they'll need to build solar arrays or something too) and they'll need feedstock (if a hive requires one tenth of an ounce of gallium and you're nowhere near any then you're out of luck) but they should be able to do so. I like the 'convert every robot on the station into a remote controlled bomb' idea, but it would probably take a while, and I imagine that they check for those sorts of things pretty regularly - maybe scanning the bots for nanites every maintenance cycle or something - people are still extremely terrified of rogue nanoswarms making their robo-butlers into decapitation machines. If you could find a way to make sure that maintenance didn't find out about it it would be pretty awesome though. And yeah they could pull the pins on grenades - except to grenades in EP even use pins any more? And anyway the bots could probably just crawl inside the thing and activate the detonator from inside without bothering the pin. What I'm being reminded of is that there is no upper limit to the devious crap you can do with nanoswarms.
Baalbamoth Baalbamoth's picture
ok, so transhuman goes over how to reprogram nanites...
theres a programing key that if you spend a day or two observing the nanites you can pick up, once you have the key it allows you to reprogram them... uh... so if you had a hive near somebody or heck everybody who is near by, and you programed the nanites to constantly invade the targets and observe medichenes.. then you could feasably at any time re-program the healing nanos to do the exact oppsite and pretty much there'd be nearly no way of stopping them? heck after killing the hosts you could have them reprogramed to dissassemble the hab...
"what do I want? The usual — hundreds of grandchildren, complete dominion over the known worlds, and the pleasure of hearing that all my enemies have died in highly improbable accidents that cannot be connected to me."
NewtonPulsifer NewtonPulsifer's picture
Part of the problem you're
Part of the problem you're having is that Eclipse Phase nanites defy physics. On analysis they just wouldn't work as well or as quickly as they are described in the game. So a "hard sci-fi" approach to reason out the capabilities of nanites based on the book descriptions is going to be impossible, as you'll too easily be able to come up with physics defying magic.
"I fear all we have done is to awaken a sleeping giant and fill him with a terrible resolve."- Isoroku Yamamoto
Baalbamoth Baalbamoth's picture
yeah
Nanites=magic
"what do I want? The usual — hundreds of grandchildren, complete dominion over the known worlds, and the pleasure of hearing that all my enemies have died in highly improbable accidents that cannot be connected to me."