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EP Core for FATE: awesome/meh/eeew?

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Fri, 2013-06-07 10:35
CodeBreaker CodeBreaker's picture
Baalbamoth wrote:(facepalm)
Baalbamoth wrote:
(facepalm) well I guess bring on the anime-furry pron, cutters, "real" vampires, and pachulii salesmen, storytelling is in the haus.
So, this got me thinking. When you say something like that, my mind immediately jumps to World of Darkness. I don't have much of an issue with WoD, but it is the setting that my mind goes to when 'real vampires' are brought up. So I have a question; Do you consider the Storytelling system (what is used by WoD) to be a storytelling game system? Because if you do, I really need to hear why. And if you don't, then surely you are admitting that the people you seem to scared are going to defile the purity of Eclipse Phase are already here?
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Fri, 2013-06-07 14:21
Decivre Decivre's picture
CodeBreaker wrote:So, this
CodeBreaker wrote:
So, this got me thinking. When you say something like that, my mind immediately jumps to World of Darkness. I don't have much of an issue with WoD, but it is the setting that my mind goes to when 'real vampires' are brought up. So I have a question; Do you consider the Storytelling system (what is used by WoD) to be a storytelling game system? Because if you do, I really need to hear why. And if you don't, then surely you are admitting that the people you seem to scared are going to defile the purity of Eclipse Phase are already here?
I was thinking the same thing. While an STG like Monsterhearts is clearly something he would loathe, I have yet to see a single game of FATE that was anything he seems to be afraid of. The game that's being run in our game shop right now is a steampunk western that, to me, feels like Deadlands minus the supernatural... or Wild Wild West with all the serial numbers shaved off. The FATE settings I know of are a semi-soft sci-fi RPG (Diaspora), another hard sci-fi transhuman RPG with different themes (Nova Praxis), a pulp setting that looks like something straight inspired by Indiana Jones (Spirit of the Century), a Superhero RPG (ICONS), and a magepunk setting (Dresden Files). I can't find any of the things he seems to be complaining about in the FATE community. And last time I checked the game for furries was Pathfinder (I think the supplement is Furrsona), and the "real vampires" loved World of Darkness. So the problem he's worried about started a couple decades ago, and is far worse with traditional roleplaying games.
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Transhumans will one day be the Luddites of the posthuman age. [url=http://bit.ly/2p3wk7c]Help me get my gaming fix, if you want.[/url]
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Fri, 2013-06-07 14:37
AdamJury AdamJury's picture
I don't ever really exercise
I don't ever really exercise "moderation" on the forums, but let's all be honest with ourselves: serious differing opinions and styles aren't going to change in a forum discussion. Every single decision we make as a company can alienate people and it can please others -- not just players and GMs, but also including distributors, retailers, and other game publishers. We work collaboratively to make the best decisions possible, and in almost every case, we err on the side of trying to make our players happy. We believe that making smart decisions that make fans happy leads to business success. The real trick is figuring out which things that make fans happy is actually smart in the long term. We've made some "dangerous" decisions over the years -- releasing EP under a CC license, selling the core book PDF for only $15 when core book PDF prices were typically $25 or higher, reprinting a large number of copies of the core book a few years back in a "soft" RPG market. People are less likely to notice when we make a conservative decision, especially when that decision is "we aren't going to do X," because that discussion may never leave the company. We aren't going to please everyone all the time, especially as our fan base grows. But that is no excuse to not try and grow our fan base and expand our company, both in terms of a breadth of Eclipse Phase offerings and also into other games and game styles. I think all the necessary factual statements about the Fate Conversion Guide have been made, but let me run them down again: * Fate Conversion Guide is going to be a small book, not a complete 400-page alternative core book. * We're going to hire experienced Fate authors and editors to work on it. * It doesn't replace any project that we are currently working on; it's additional (like all of the other stretch goals are.) * We have no plans to dual-stat future Eclipse Phase books. We aren't sure how we'll handle converting that material to Fate or if we will; that will depend on the reception to the Conversion Guide. * We're obviously still supporting Eclipse Phase, including the Transhuman Open Playtest, the upcoming release of Transhuman, and then onto Firewall and future books (not to mention all the stretch goal stuff.) Thanks for reading. Enjoy Eclipse Phase. :-)
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Fri, 2013-06-07 16:07
Murgh Bpurn Murgh Bpurn's picture
Thanks Adam for the
Thanks Adam for the clarifications. Will the Fate Core conversion involve any open playtesting?
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Fri, 2013-06-07 16:14
AdamJury AdamJury's picture
Murgh Bpurn wrote:Thanks Adam
Murgh Bpurn wrote:
Thanks Adam for the clarifications. Will the Fate Core conversion involve any open playtesting?
Hey, sorry for missing your question about this earlier! I can't promise that we'll open playtest the Conversion Guide yet, but I suspect that we will. :)
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Fri, 2013-06-07 21:18
bluetyson bluetyson's picture
AdamJury wrote:
AdamJury wrote:
We've made some "dangerous" decisions over the years -- releasing EP under a CC license
You made it an unkillable immortal postrpg. :) So any claims that anyone can destroy it clearly doesn't understand that, for one thing.
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http://freesf.strandedinoz.com/wordpress
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Fri, 2013-06-07 23:10
bluetyson bluetyson's picture
double tracking, old school
Murgh Bpurn wrote:
Stress and consequences are hit points by another name. I agree with Decrivre you don't know how Fate works.
Champions has Stun and Body, even, from memory.
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http://freesf.strandedinoz.com/wordpress
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Sat, 2013-06-08 15:54
bblonski bblonski's picture
Fate's stress and
Fate's stress and consequences actually remind me a lot of Shadownrun's Condition Monitor health system. The only difference being instead of wounds happening automatically when you check off certain boxes, you can choose to take a wound or mark off boxes which adds another tactical decision to combat. Baalbamoth is confusing Fate with something like Fiasco. Fate is very much an RPG, it just tries to simulate fiction rather than physics. There is some extra hand waving going on, but this is to help simulate things that are hard to represent with traditional mechanics but are common in fiction. Fate is also simpler and more streamlined in general. Now you could level this as a legitimate complaint against it. EP, I feel, appeals more to the technical crowd who enjoy the complexity in the setting. Everyone has a difference preference of how complex they want their ruleset. Fate can sometimes abstract away too many details, but the tradeoff is that EP becomes a lot more approachable for more casual role players. Some people might not be welcoming to more casual players, but I find it makes it a lot easier to get a group together. Once players are familiar with the setting, it could make it easier to transition into the traditional d99 ruleset. Will the Fate conversion also include rules for Fate -> d99 character conversions? This could be a great feature for easing a new group into EP and capturing interest from the Fate crowd.
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Sat, 2013-06-08 20:44
bluetyson bluetyson's picture
old school ideas
bluetyson wrote:
Murgh Bpurn wrote:
Stress and consequences are hit points by another name. I agree with Decrivre you don't know how Fate works.
Champions has Stun and Body, even, from memory.
Browsing Star Ace even, last night... wound boxes and Luck
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http://freesf.strandedinoz.com/wordpress
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Sun, 2013-06-09 05:36
Gnothi_Sauton Gnothi_Sauton's picture
Some thoughts
I actually worked on a conversion of EP to the FATE-system inspired by Diaspora. The project took a huge amount of time and is probably never to be finished now that I know that the conversionguide is on its way. During this time I learned some interesting things that I look forward too. One example is that Morphs can be handled as an Aspect and very easy to change just by erasing one row on the charactersheet. Very convenient. The players should have allot more fatepoints from start than is suggested in Fate Core. The reason is to avoid "clumsy drama" just for the reason to gain points. Humor is good, but to force it on the setting by mechanics is not good. I do hope the guide give suggestions how to give the players new points not by making fools of the characters. "Well, we did allot of mistakes on the road and a few enemies showed up, but in the the end it was all blaze and glory." I also like the idea in Diaspora that one can compel the aspect "out of ammo". It would be fun if these kind of aspects where involved in combat. This is going to be fun!
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Tue, 2013-06-11 15:43
Solar Solar's picture
I really cannot stand FATE.
Nothing really wrong with FATE, but personally I do not like it, not one bit. I like some storygames, but I find FATE as a system to be terminally uninteresting. EP core has far more to sink my teeth into, I like the system a lot. I also find that it works for the setting and tone of the game far more than FATE does. It does slightly annoy me that resources are being spent on a FATE conversion, because FATE is becoming more and more prevalent (which is not something I like to see, for obvious reasons), but eh, it'll just be this one thing.
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Sun, 2013-06-16 12:42
EccentricOwl EccentricOwl's picture
Very excited!
Personally, I can't wait for this supplement. Know that I'm proud to have pitched my extra dollars towards this possible product! I think that the complaints of the "diverting resources" argument are valid. The video game "Spec Ops: The Line" was a critique of shooting games; it was the sort of game where you wouldn't want multiplayer. But, multiplayer was forced into it anyway. I can see the desire to have resources spent on 'core' EP materials.. but for me, this is 'core' EP material! I think one of the first posters casually mentioned that the system has never been its strong suit, and I'm inclined to agree. Let's be honest, who really bought "Eclipse Phase" for its system alone? What better system to use than something that has broad appeal and high reviews? I absolutely adored my time running "Diaspora" (far more than the new Fate Core) and the very mention that the fantastic writers behind my favorite setting would be helping to convert their game to another format. While I understand the reservations of some of these forum-goers, I think that this is a fantastic product. It is literally the one supplement that I wanted to see over all others. :)
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Mon, 2014-03-03 10:01
InsidiousAlgorythm InsidiousAlgorythm's picture
After finally picking up Fate
After finally picking up Fate Core and reading through it, I'm kinda hyped about the conversion guide. Not so much that I want to run my EP games in Fate (My campaign is using the original rules and I'm not going to switch up in the mid game), but rather the ability to use some of the EP concepts in an unrelated Fate game later.
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