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Datagogues - an intriguing term

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jhfurnish jhfurnish's picture
Datagogues - an intriguing term
While reading 'Panopticon', I came upon the term 'datagogues'. This predicts a reactionary media tactic developed by authoritarians and other deceivers in response to the effective sousveillance of a public defending itself against repression: throwing massive, sheer walls of data into the public media in order to overwhelm and deter dissenters and critics. From page 17 of 'Panopticon': The response many organizations adopted then ... is to provide overwhelming amounts of data to the public. This provided a two-fold defense. First, it allowed immediate deniability to any charge of withholding data. Second, the sheer volume of data available meant that almost any argument could be made or refuted with selective referencing and correlation to other publicly available information. This is a rapid, cheap response that puts the onus back on the accuser to make detailed and documented claims of specific wrongdoing, thus aiding efforts to discredit detractors. Given the hyperabundance of information, few had the time or desire to sort through it all to get a complete understanding of what was going on. The switch to the disclosure model created a new service opportunity for datagogues, interpreters, and self-described experts (read: pundits, emphasis mine)to sort through all of the information and provide ready-made arguments in support of whomever paid them. With selective correlation, virtually any position could be defended. Analysts with decent reputations often garnered more followers and interest than the actual data released. This has in fact already happened, at least in the theater of debate. Not only do pundits somewhat do this, but also fundamentalist theologans, and presidential candidates during debates. The specific tactic to which I refer, and of which the above-referenced term reminded me, is an argumentative fallacy known as the Gish Gallop. It was named for a creationist who employs this technique in debates with scientists, Duane Gish. From Wikipedia.org: "Eugenie Scott, executive director of the National Center for Science Education, has dubbed approach the "Gish Gallop," describing it as "where the creationist is allowed to run on for 45 minutes or an hour, spewing forth torrents of error that the evolutionist hasn't a prayer of refuting in the format of a debate." An even better definition comes form Newsvine, which is essentially a user-contributed 'news wiki'. http://redsfan.newsvine.com/_news/2012/10/04/14226423-romney-won-using-a... "The Urban Dictionary defines the Gish Gallop thusly: "Named for the debate tactic created by creationist shill Duane Gish, a Gish Gallop involves spewing so much bull@!$%# in such a short span on that your opponent can’t address let alone counter all of it. To make matters worse a Gish Gallop will often have one or more 'talking points' that has a tiny core of truth to it, making the person rebutting it spend even more time debunking it in order to explain that, yes, it's not totally false but the Galloper is distorting/misusing/misstating the actual situation. Thus, we are now in an age wherein a Wall of Data is like a gauntlet thrown down as a challenge to the public's intellectual autonomy. Naturally, as the media continues to evolve in the direction predicted in Eclipse Phase, this will become even easier and more commonly practiced. It will be a vast challenge even for someone's Muse to sort it all out so they can debate even via written mails. Thus, there will be a new kind of pundit in the future, although vastly sooner than 2500 A.D.: the datagogue. Hit'em with the Wall of Data, and they'll get so dizzy they won't bother questioning anything. They'll just give up. Once again, technology designed to liberate will be twisted into a tool of repression. This is a crucial challenge to users of technology today, and will continue to be so for the long-term future, assuming a technologically-capable (trans)Humanity survives.
Xagroth Xagroth's picture
The internet as it is today
The internet as it is today is a great example of what happens when you have too much data, and you don't know if its true or not. Wikipedia is (in)famous for "killing" people for a few hours, thanks to the public contribution that's based upon, for example. And yeah, google-fu is becoming exceedingly important... and harder.
Axel the Chimeric Axel the Chimeric's picture
My problem with this
I think that this idea doesn't really work since the development of the internet. There are enough dedicated investigative citizen journalists out there that, no matter how many documents you put out, they will cut through it like a hot knife through butter. We see it time and again. All it takes is people being sufficiently angry. The obvious solution is that the companies involved just plain won't reveal any data that would be useful in condemning them. Will they release documents saying that they're doing some saintly charity project? Hell yes. Will they release the data about them forcing some African villagers off their land? Hell no. To think corporations, or any individual for that matter, would deliberately make public documents that cast them in a negative light is just... Silly.
Erenthia Erenthia's picture
One interesting possibility
One interesting possibility is to create false [em]opponents[/em]. The Strawman Incarnate. You could drown out the voices of those who've figured out your secrets with an entire chorus of crazy-seeming lunatics who are absolutely convinced you are working with Nine Lives to smuggle stolen Alpha Forks back to the TITANs in a sort of ritual sacrifice to allow humanity to continue to existing. (I've been influenced heavily by the Darksun setting) I just got an idea for a conspiracy theorist character who doesn't realize he's actually a tailored Fork designed to latch on to a specific company and feel desperate to expose their secrets. They feed him all kinds of "leaked documents" so that he'll generate wild theories, easily dismissed by the public, when in fact the hypercorps activities, while morally repugnant and highly illegal, are far more down to earth. He'd make a great quest giver...
The end really is coming. What comes after that is anyone's guess.
jhfurnish jhfurnish's picture
Erenthia wrote:One
Erenthia wrote:
One interesting possibility is to create false [em]opponents[/em]. The Strawman Incarnate.
They are always creating an Emannuel Goldstein in this country's presses. We receive Osama bin Laden, or some other person from the Middle East. It's the prescription for the Five Minute Hate. (There should be a band by that name.) We should be getting a new one soon.
OneTrikPony OneTrikPony's picture
I'm certain that there are
I'm certain that there are tens of thousands of indentured infomorphs charged with these activities everywhere in the inner system. Like chinese gold farmers in WoW but with real world application working for marketing and rep insurance companies. How much do you figure it would cost an individual to keep a service like this on retainer? High or expensive / month?

Mea Culpa: My mode of speech can make others feel uninvited to argue or participate. This is the EXACT opposite of what I intend when I post.

jhfurnish jhfurnish's picture
Infomorphs
Well, an infomorph doesn't have to be fed. You've just gotta keep the power on and have an AI watch them stay on-task. It can't be that expensive. The Jovians would essentially have them in slavery, and other entities would have a nominally better situation in 'indentured servitude'. In other places, the Infomorphs would expect to do this kind of work as a matter of course and be able to set their price.
OneTrikPony OneTrikPony's picture
When did the jovians start
When did the jovians start allowing info morphs and AI's? I was just sayin that the setting supports your datagogue as a trade because a quarter of a billion info morphs need something to do and they'd be much better at it than AI. :)

Mea Culpa: My mode of speech can make others feel uninvited to argue or participate. This is the EXACT opposite of what I intend when I post.

jhfurnish jhfurnish's picture
OneTrikPony wrote:When did
OneTrikPony wrote:
When did the jovians start allowing info morphs and AI's? I was just sayin that the setting supports your datagogue as a trade because a quarter of a billion info morphs need something to do and they'd be much better at it than AI. :)
Well, first, even if the Jovians don't like infomorphs and AI's, it doesn't mean that somewhere in their system someone won't find a need for them in their machinations. They're totalitarians, after all. The United States of America, supposedly a free republic, has increasingly ruthless - and unneeded - methods of crowd control that will soon be well beyond the pale once they've correctly weaponized these drones for the job. Governments and their dogmas don't always match their gear. Second, they'll need someone in there to watch over the transhuman infomorphs, and I'm not certain any Jovians will want to be sleeved as infomorphs (as such) but would rather have an AI or, if they're willing, an AGI crack the whip on them. Finally, yes, it would definitely be useful to use infomorphs.
Gantolandon Gantolandon's picture
The thing is, with widespread
The thing is, with widespread social networks and rampart [i]sousveillance[/i], it's not so easy. You may pose as an expert and throw some garbage hoping no one will care enough and, if the topic is not too important, this may work. But interest enough people and there always be that one nerd, who might not even know anything except the topic you discuss, and destroy you. He doesn't even have to refute everything, just enough to unmask you as a fraud. Then people ding you, post hateful comments on your profile and set their Muses to filter you out. Your reputation is in tatters and no one wants to associate with you, especially in pure rep economies. You may build yourself an artificial identity, but this is an art within an art. Most people will ignore a wall of data coming from a random nobody. They will, however, hear out a recognized expert, especially if he seems neutral and unaffiliated with interested parties. You can either patiently build up your rep, or just pay people from ID Crew a visit. The strawman variant seems less resource-intensive, because this time you want random nobodies to speak against you. At worst, people will assume that someone is attacking you with his sockpuppets. You may also work patiently to build them as pathetic and unlikeable as possible, with relevant reps in double-digit negatives. Or just pose as an existing authority figure. Kidnap him and fry his stack, and sleeve your fork into his morph. Risky, with widespread brainscans, but desperate times sometimes call for desperate measures. You may also, instead of killing his ego, modify it a bit to be unable to disagree with you. That's if you want to go full villain. Hell, you don't even have to use actual arguments. Want to lower the chance of a particular politician to win elections? Flood the local mesh with a virus which will subtly modify every occurrence of his carefully sculpted face in the ads. It could replace patches of the skin to appear necrotic or cancerous - even after all these years, a subconscious fear of disease is still pretty strong. Or it could subtly alter facial features: the face in the ad smiles at you, but its eyes are now full of anger and hate. Or, during a public speech, display a swarm of penises surrounding the candidate and singing obscene songs. It doesn't even have to be a virus. Just some popular AR enhancement, that usually adds beautiful vines to these boring, steel walls. Its additional features are buried deeply in the code - they can be discovered sooner or later, but not before damage is already done.
Rada Ion Rada Ion's picture
jhfurnish wrote:Erenthia
jhfurnish wrote:
Erenthia wrote:
One interesting possibility is to create false [em]opponents[/em]. The Strawman Incarnate.
They are always creating an Emannuel Goldstein in this country's presses. We receive Osama bin Laden, or some other person from the Middle East. It's the prescription for the Five Minute Hate. (There should be a band by that name.) We should be getting a new one soon.
I am a big fan of the five minute hate thing, you get a chance to see who can and who cannot think for them selves. It's very enlightening IMHO.
Erenthia Erenthia's picture
Most US ideals probably ended
Most US ideals probably ended up with the Autonomists, specifically the anarchists. It's sad how the totalitarian threads of both small factions in the States and China have a bigger social footprint. Absolutely realistic, but sad. "The good men do..." and all that. The nice thing about a strawman fork is that is tends to prejudice people against all negative ideas against the company. In fact with enough resources, you could create an entire news organization dedicated opposing your political agenda in the most facile and unintellectual of ways. The best part of course is that they are real-seeming opponents who actually believe the nonsense they are spouting while being completely incapable of making more cogent of an argument. It doesn't matter that your real opponents might have a point. It only matters that people come to associate your opponents with the strawmen.
The end really is coming. What comes after that is anyone's guess.
jhfurnish jhfurnish's picture
Erenthia wrote:... with
Erenthia wrote:
... with enough resources, you could create an entire news organization dedicated opposing your political agenda in the most facile and unintellectual of ways. The best part of course is that they are real-seeming opponents who actually believe the nonsense they are spouting while being completely incapable of making more cogent of an argument. It doesn't matter that your real opponents might have a point. It only matters that people come to associate your opponents with the strawmen.
There are organizations like that out there already. Think of 'Wise Use', a short-lived strawman company set up by ecologically dangerous corporations to help derail the ecological movement. The infamous James Watt (first head of the Environmental Protection Agency) likely had a hand in their creation.
jhfurnish jhfurnish's picture
Coming back to this...
...we now see the Powers-That-Be resurrecting an old Cult of Personality from the East, in its newest incarnation: the young Kim Jong Un of North Korea, our new Emmanuel Goldstein. I have seen evidence that he's actually being paid to sound off like this in order to create a chain of economic reactions to these 'psuedoevents'. Meanwhile some of the more sober political commentators point out that actual warfare is completely impractical for North Korea, especially in the light of China's interests (that is, to actually start a real shooting war). People have to decide what they believe. The Powers don't yet feel they can get away with taking full control of all venues of public discourse or we wouldn't be hearing any flavor of counterpoint at all, of course. How would such a thing work out in the world of Eclipse Phase? Easily: you would have the Jovians rattling a saber at someone in the Rimward societies, maybe the folks on Dischord, because the hypercorps want access to their Gate for its unique destinations unreachable on the Gates already in their control. Of course, the Jovians are an actual power rather than just a tinfoil-hat dicatorship, but they might not be above letting themselves be cast as a convenient villain if they're cut in for the prize, plus see their natural political enemies - antiauthoritarians - weakened in the process. It would come down to control of public venues of discussion plus the number and quality (in terms of credibility/reputation) of voices on each side of the issue that is created. "Will the Jovians really attack the folks on Dischord if they don't open up their access to the Gate?"