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Memory Lock Implant Vs Stress damage...

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Fri, 2012-08-03 16:30

Xagroth

Memory Lock Implant Vs Stress damage...

I was looking for something else when I stumbled upon the Memory Lock Implant (Panopticon pg 149). It says nothing about it, but... Do you think a character could engage the implant (with a timer, since he could forget he turned it on!) before engaging into some activities that would grant Stress Value damage to lose that damage after the timer goes out? He would be unable to form any kind of memory of the actual incident, so... :S

Fri, 2012-08-03 17:29

Tnargraef

Stress is both mental and

Stress is both mental and physical. While they would forget the mental part of it, the physical part would still be there.

Fri, 2012-08-03 19:14

TadanoriOyama TadanoriOyama's picture

How would he know what he did

How would he know what he did later then? I mean unless he has a "stree dive buddy" or something he's going to be stumbling around with big holes in his memory. He can't know what he did or it'll still be stressful and if he doesn't know what he did then everything he sees on the news might have been him. Sounds like a situation that would end up with a net gain on stress.

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Fri, 2012-08-03 20:13

Geonis

My thoughts

Remembering the event isn't necessary for the mind to be damaged during it. There are multiple mental illnesses that can be acquire prior to longer term memory being developed, a child gains long term memory at about age 1 if I recall correctly. Also, the psychosurgeric act of removing memories does nothing for relieving mental strain, and effectively does the same thing. In short, no, I don't believe it would help all that much. You would be freaked out about neotenics, but have no memory as to why.

Sat, 2012-08-04 09:13

Xagroth

I wouldn't take into account

I wouldn't take into account the child's example: while it might be true they cannot form long term memories before their first year (I use the conditional because I don't know and neither I want to make the searching effort ^^), the difference is that the brain is developing, and thus I think the trauma would affect the way the braing will end. So if the trauma is also physicall, if I forgot the event and resleeved, I should be healed...

Sat, 2012-08-04 13:08

Tnargraef

Seems like an awful lot of

Seems like an awful lot of work that could cause even more stress

Sat, 2012-08-04 15:43

Xagroth

Not necessarily, it would

Not necessarily, it would depend on the amount of SV suffered and if the ego can sleeve without a roll in that kind of morph. I know this is very situational and quite the munchkin idea, personally I wouldn't really allow it in my games (for simplicity's sake, if nothing else). I just had this little 25W lightbulb lighting above my head with the "amnesia canbe a self-defense reaction to traumatic events" from something I was watching.

Sat, 2012-08-04 16:18

Arenamontanus Arenamontanus's picture

I think you could get stress

I think you could get stress from non-remembered events, since memory is not a single system and memory locks are likely just locking explicit memory (episodic "what happened" memories and semantic knowledge memories). Learning happening in procedural and emotional memories might be unaffected, and this could allow plenty of stress to be stored. After all, PTSD is likely mainly the amygdala setting up a super-strong association between some states and bad feelings. There might also be bad habit or implicit memories created by a shock. I doubt that is going to be fixed by blocking the other systems.

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Sun, 2012-08-05 16:10

DivineWrath DivineWrath's picture

I remember reading something

I remember reading something about an elderly lady who lost the ability to develop new long term memories. Each time she visited her doctor, it was like the first time for her. The doctor ended up doing some pranks where he would shake her hand with while holding something prickly. After the doctor repeated the prank a few times, she became certain that the said doctor, whom she had no memory of meeting before, was going to prick her hand during a hand shake. The article then suggested that the brain may have some ability to remember pain and fear separately from our other memories.

Sun, 2012-08-05 16:22

#10

DivineWrath DivineWrath's picture

Another thing to consider is

Another thing to consider is learning. If you somehow are able to prevent yourself from remembering some traumatic event, I don't think you would be able to learn from it. Learning requires knowledge and experiences, which the Memory Lock implant can prevent. I would argue that if you had this implant on while you went to university classes, when you read your text books, and while you did your homework, you wouldn't have learned a thing. If you solution did somehow manage to work, you would probably be getting less RP than other characters. That or you might be unable to spend RP on skills (and other character stats) relating to things you had no opportunity to learn about.

Sun, 2012-08-05 21:32

#11

Madwand

Yes.

Yes, you could do it. If for some reason the GM did not allow it, play a synth and take incremental backups of your ego to your mesh inserts. Whenever a stressful event happens, revert your ego to an earlier backup that did not suffer the stress. Have your muse tell you what happened, or record and playback the event, filtering it so that it doesn't stress you out. Note that you are effectively committing suicide by doing this, but that's normal for any transhuman ego. You WILL suffer the Continuity stress by doing this (missing out on time), but it might be worth it anyway. Also, as mentioned, your GM will be justified to reduce any experience reward because you learned less.

Mon, 2012-08-06 03:22

#12

Xagroth

Madwand wrote:Yes, you could

Madwand wrote:
Yes, you could do it. If for some reason the GM did not allow it, play a synth and take incremental backups of your ego to your mesh inserts. Whenever a stressful event happens, revert your ego to an earlier backup that did not suffer the stress. Have your muse tell you what happened, or record and playback the event, filtering it so that it doesn't stress you out. Note that you are effectively committing suicide by doing this, but that's normal for any transhuman ego. You WILL suffer the Continuity stress by doing this (missing out on time), but it might be worth it anyway. Also, as mentioned, your GM will be justified to reduce any experience reward because you learned less.

There is always the option of just using a biomorph with a cyberbrain, it serves as right, but you will need some "down time" every time you wanna revert to a previous backup. Anyway, the idea was precisely to avert the continuity test (which we cannot avoid: seems that you can be used to sleeve into certain type of bodies, but you cannot get used to die! XD) when the amount of stress in the ego was so high it was much more interesting to just use a backup.

Mon, 2012-08-06 04:23

#13

Arenamontanus Arenamontanus's picture

The old lady example is good.

The old lady example is good. She probably got a strong association in the amygdala linking the doctor's handshake to a negative emotion. Meanwhile her hippocampus was not working (Alzheimer or some other damage), making her unable to encode the episodic information ("Last week you pranked me!"). I certainly think you can construct implants that abolish any form of bad feelings or memories from traumatic events, for example by rapid backups. but that means you will now get the consequences... again and again as you discover them. "So, where's my family? Oh NOOOOO!!!! ... So, where's my family? Oh NOOOOO!!!! ... So, where's my family? Oh NOOOOO!!!! ... So, where's my family? Oh NOOOOO!!!! ... So, where's my family? Oh NOOOOO!!!! ... " Another solution is to remove the learning and emotions altogether. When you don't care about anything, you get around a lot of mental stress. Of course, you may never turn off those implants since then everything that happened will return to you with full force. "So you dismembered my family and smashed their stacks because they were looking at you strangely? How fascinating. I must say this is a delicious meatloaf... family leftovers, you say? Oh, you pranked me good there! Could I have seconds?"

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Mon, 2012-08-06 05:28

#14

Chevre

If all you're after is not

If all you're after is not taking stress from events, a drug gland that produces Neem (p.318). At that point you're so emotionless you make Spock look like The Fonz, though.

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Mon, 2012-08-06 07:53

#15

Myrmidont

If you watched Doctor Who...

...recall that waking up covered in check marks might be just as disturbing as seeing a Silence. That is, effectively, what is happening: While the morph doesn't remember the actions that took place, it still has to live with the consequences of what happened during the time it has blanked out. Let's face it - in Eclipse Phase, any event that is likely to hit you for stress damage is likely to affect you in other ways. [i]You are about to go into your bond-partner's bedroom - DISJUNCTION - and now you're standing outside the room, your hands are bloody, there's red hand prints around the frame where someone - you? - must have emerged, you can taste bile in your mouth and now your muse is politely insisting that you really, really need to know what you just did inside...[/i]

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Mon, 2012-08-06 17:22

#16

Chevre

Myrmidont wrote:You are about

Myrmidont wrote:
[i]You are about to go into your bond-partner's bedroom - DISJUNCTION - and now you're standing outside the room, your hands are bloody, there's red hand prints around the frame where someone - you? - must have emerged, you can taste bile in your mouth and now your muse is politely insisting that you really, really need to know what you just did inside...[/i]

That's a heck of a character origin. Can I use that for an NPC?

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Tue, 2012-08-07 04:04

#17

Xagroth

Chevre wrote:Myrmidont wrote

Chevre wrote:
Myrmidont wrote:
[i]You are about to go into your bond-partner's bedroom - DISJUNCTION - and now you're standing outside the room, your hands are bloody, there's red hand prints around the frame where someone - you? - must have emerged, you can taste bile in your mouth and now your muse is politely insisting that you really, really need to know what you just did inside...[/i]
That's a heck of a character origin. Can I use that for an NPC?

Now there is the question of this NPC having the Multiple Personalities implant without knowing it, the skillsoft he bought was not all that pruned, the morph he's using is not as scrubbed as it should, an Async is controlling him, or he is just nuts... Not to mention the possibility of a hacking! Scary, all the possibilities to justify you not being in control of your acts XD

Wed, 2012-08-08 19:58

#18

Chevre

I know. Fun, isn't it?

I know. Fun, isn't it? Terrifying, but fun.

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