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CERN Discovers God Particle with LHC?

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Mon, 2012-07-02 16:05
#1
LordNephets LordNephets's picture
CERN Discovers God Particle with LHC?
I came across a news article today that states that CERNS Large Hadron Collider may have discovered the Higgs Boson "God particle" There are lots of articles, so I will let you sift through the searches. https://www.google.com/search?rlz=1C1TSNO_enUS463US463&sugexp=chrome,mod...
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All sciences are now under the obligation to prepare the ground for the future task of the philosopher, which is to solve the problem of value, to determine the true hierarchy of values.
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Thu, 2012-07-05 16:41
Quincey Forder Quincey Forder's picture
Re: CERN Discovers God Particle with LHC?
What application does that discovery have in our setting, a century and a half from now?
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Thu, 2012-07-05 22:06
Decivre Decivre's picture
Re: CERN Discovers God Particle with LHC?
Quincey Forder wrote:
What application does that discovery have in our setting, a century and a half from now?
If it's actually the Higgs, not necessarily much. It just confirms the standard model. We might find out how to manipulate Higgs bosons eventually, but what those effects might be are up in the air. We simply don't know what will happen. We only know what was assessed in theory—that the Higgs boson produces the property of mass. If it isn't the Higgs, who knows what it will result in?
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Transhumans will one day be the Luddites of the posthuman age. [url=http://bit.ly/2p3wk7c]Help me get my gaming fix, if you want.[/url]
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Fri, 2012-07-06 12:25
Quincey Forder Quincey Forder's picture
Re: CERN Discovers God Particle with LHC?
Could we end up with a mass effect like technology? (I would emmigrate to Thessia in a heart beat! I (heart) Asari!)
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Sun, 2012-07-08 13:25
LordNephets LordNephets's picture
Re: CERN Discovers God Particle with LHC?
What is more important than the scientific aspect of confirming the Higgs Boson, is the social aspect of such a discovery. The particle is not dubbed the "God Particle" for no small reason. A true confirmation of such a particle and similar particles can literally disprove the existence of God and the validity of all religious beliefs. Additionally, such discoveries could lead into vast new technologies that would allow human settlement outside the planet Earth to be much more possible, the ability to give mass and thusly gravity to an unstable moon system for example.
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All sciences are now under the obligation to prepare the ground for the future task of the philosopher, which is to solve the problem of value, to determine the true hierarchy of values.
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Sun, 2012-07-08 18:17
Decivre Decivre's picture
Re: CERN Discovers God Particle with LHC?
LordNephets wrote:
What is more important than the scientific aspect of confirming the Higgs Boson, is the social aspect of such a discovery. The particle is not dubbed the "God Particle" for no small reason. A true confirmation of such a particle and similar particles can literally disprove the existence of God and the validity of all religious beliefs. Additionally, such discoveries could lead into vast new technologies that would allow human settlement outside the planet Earth to be much more possible, the ability to give mass and thusly gravity to an unstable moon system for example.
That's not why it's called the God Particle. The first major book about the Higgs Boson was titled "The God Particle" due to the author attributing its discovery to being as amazing as finding god, not because it would disprove him/her/its existence. Journalists ran with it from there. The Higgs Boson discovery proves the standard model, and does nothing to determine whether the universe is created from an intelligence or naturally spontaneous. And I say this as a fervent atheist.
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Transhumans will one day be the Luddites of the posthuman age. [url=http://bit.ly/2p3wk7c]Help me get my gaming fix, if you want.[/url]
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Sun, 2012-07-08 19:21
Azathoth Azathoth's picture
Re: CERN Discovers God Particle with LHC?
LordNephets wrote:
A true confirmation of such a particle and similar particles can literally disprove the existence of God and the validity of all religious beliefs.
I'm with Decivre on this one (and I'm agnostic ;)). I don't think you can ever completely "disprove" God using science. Many people of faith put god (however they might define it) outside of the realm of science or the physical universe. While science may be able to explain many (and presumably someday, all) of the "how"s of the world, it doesn't satisfactorily explain the "why"s for many people. Though we are well beyond the point where we use god to explain physical phenomena we simply don't understand, and these discoveries do help shrink the vast realm of the unknown. :)
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Sun, 2012-07-08 21:24
LordNephets LordNephets's picture
Re: CERN Discovers God Particle with LHC?
Maybe I should have clarified. I definitely worded myself poorly looking at what I wrote, because I was rushed when I wrote it. Yes, the social implications of this discovery, and possible future discoveries will be great in an anti-religious way. Not because the "God Particle" disproves the existence of God, but because that is how people will perceive it. There is always a vast difference between the truth of something, and what the general public perceives it as. Despite what the educated community knows, what the public believes will not necessarily be true. I.E. while intelligent beings will look at the Higgs Boson and realize what it does, those who are not so inclined will look at the "God Particle" and be convinced that religion has been proven false.
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All sciences are now under the obligation to prepare the ground for the future task of the philosopher, which is to solve the problem of value, to determine the true hierarchy of values.
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Sun, 2012-07-08 23:20
Decivre Decivre's picture
Re: CERN Discovers God Particle with LHC?
LordNephets wrote:
Maybe I should have clarified. I definitely worded myself poorly looking at what I wrote, because I was rushed when I wrote it. Yes, the social implications of this discovery, and possible future discoveries will be great in an anti-religious way. Not because the "God Particle" disproves the existence of God, but because that is how people will perceive it. There is always a vast difference between the truth of something, and what the general public perceives it as. Despite what the educated community knows, what the public believes will not necessarily be true. I.E. while intelligent beings will look at the Higgs Boson and realize what it does, those who are not so inclined will look at the "God Particle" and be convinced that religion has been proven false.
I disagree. That would be like saying that the book "The God Delusion" destroyed religion already, when it actually didn't. There might be some that would use this as justification for that idea, but most won't. In fact, this will do absolutely nothing to shake the faith of believers. At best, it'll affirm the beliefs of people who think god is non-existent, and make a few more people question their reality. If anything, it might strengthen the faith of believers. I'm waiting for the day I hear "Of course god exists! Scientists have already found particles of him!"
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Transhumans will one day be the Luddites of the posthuman age. [url=http://bit.ly/2p3wk7c]Help me get my gaming fix, if you want.[/url]
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Mon, 2012-07-09 02:50
Arenamontanus Arenamontanus's picture
Re: CERN Discovers God Particle with LHC?
It is worth noting that the original term used by the interviewed physicist was "the goddam particle", but the god-fearing publisher changed it to something less outrageous (?) http://boingboing.net/2012/07/06/higgs-on-higgs.html Since the God hypothesis is unfalsifiable, it is unlikely to be disprovable by finding or not finding the boson.
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Extropian
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Mon, 2012-07-09 03:09
Decivre Decivre's picture
Re: CERN Discovers God Particle with LHC?
Arenamontanus wrote:
It is worth noting that the original term used by the interviewed physicist was "the goddam particle", but the god-fearing publisher changed it to something less outrageous (?) http://boingboing.net/2012/07/06/higgs-on-higgs.html
It's very interesting how legends form around the names for various scientific topics. The "god-damned" particle becomes the "god particle" to avoid offending god, which eventually becomes assumed to be a particle that can prove he doesn't exist (which probably would offend him as well).
Arenamontanus wrote:
Since the God hypothesis is unfalsifiable, it is unlikely to be disprovable by finding or not finding the boson.
More importantly, the God hypothesis is conjecture purely based on faith. No amount of scientific discovery will ever eliminate the human tendency to have faith in things they wish to believe in. Trying to eliminate religion with science is like trying to eliminate war with waffles. It'll never happen, no matter how many people might want it to happen.
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Transhumans will one day be the Luddites of the posthuman age. [url=http://bit.ly/2p3wk7c]Help me get my gaming fix, if you want.[/url]
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Mon, 2012-07-09 03:17
Decivre Decivre's picture
Re: CERN Discovers God Particle with LHC?
Deleted.
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Transhumans will one day be the Luddites of the posthuman age. [url=http://bit.ly/2p3wk7c]Help me get my gaming fix, if you want.[/url]
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Mon, 2012-07-09 06:08
CodeBreaker CodeBreaker's picture
Re: CERN Discovers God Particle with LHC?
Decivre wrote:
More importantly, the God hypothesis is conjecture purely based on faith. No amount of scientific discovery will ever eliminate the human tendency to have faith in things they wish to believe in. Trying to eliminate religion with science is like trying to eliminate war with waffles. It'll never happen, no matter how many people might want it to happen.
You underestimate the power of a really good waffle.
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Mon, 2012-07-09 06:37
Decivre Decivre's picture
Re: CERN Discovers God Particle with LHC?
CodeBreaker wrote:
You underestimate the power of a really good waffle.
No, you underestimate the power of a really good waffle. Because if they are good enough, people will go to war for them. Lest we forget the great waffle skirmishes of 5 BF.
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Transhumans will one day be the Luddites of the posthuman age. [url=http://bit.ly/2p3wk7c]Help me get my gaming fix, if you want.[/url]
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Mon, 2012-07-09 12:23
CodeBreaker CodeBreaker's picture
Re: CERN Discovers God Particle with LHC?
Decivre wrote:
Lest we forget the great waffle skirmishes of 5 BF.
We lost so many good people... how could they forget about the syrup? Tell me!?
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Tue, 2012-07-10 00:48
Tyrnis Tyrnis's picture
Re: CERN Discovers God Particle with LHC?
CodeBreaker wrote:
Decivre wrote:
Lest we forget the great waffle skirmishes of 5 BF.
We lost so many good people... how could they forget about the syrup? Tell me!?
You can hardly blame them after the schism between the maple syrup purists and the table syrup collective, though.
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Tue, 2012-07-10 12:57
GreyBrother GreyBrother's picture
Re: CERN Discovers God Particle with LHC?
This was something that always bothered me. Why can't we all gather at the great waffle table - provided by The Prophet - and enjoy our waffles?
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Tue, 2012-07-10 20:22
Decivre Decivre's picture
Re: CERN Discovers God Particle with LHC?
GreyBrother wrote:
This was something that always bothered me. Why can't we all gather at the great waffle table - provided by The Prophet - and enjoy our waffles?
So long as there isn't an infinite number of waffles, people will always war for the sake of having as many waffles as they can.
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Transhumans will one day be the Luddites of the posthuman age. [url=http://bit.ly/2p3wk7c]Help me get my gaming fix, if you want.[/url]
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Thu, 2012-07-12 03:21
Anarhista Anarhista's picture
Re: CERN Discovers God Particle with LHC?
Decivre wrote:
GreyBrother wrote:
This was something that always bothered me. Why can't we all gather at the great waffle table - provided by The Prophet - and enjoy our waffles?
So long as there isn't an infinite number of waffles, people will always war for the sake of having as many waffles as they can.
So we only need to divide them by zero and everything will be... Damn, I did it again!?!
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So Long, and Thanks for All the Fish.
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Sun, 2012-07-15 03:15
GreyBrother GreyBrother's picture
Re: CERN Discovers God Particle with LHC?
Gentlemen! I have discovered the truth. The universe is Waffles! I have mathematical proof. U = 4/3*Pi+waffles^1/8
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