Alkahest wrote:

What's the point? I can destroy every argument in favor of animal exploitation that its defenders care to present, but it won't change their behavior. If morality and logic dictated how people act, the world wouldn't be as filled with suffering as it is.

Group-Focused Utilitarian ShadowDragon8685 wrote:

"Allowing gangs of men to rape helpless young women, girls, and boys, is perfectly moral and logical, as long as the rapees are not diseased and the raping doesn't distract overly much from other things the men need to be doing." Now, this bears some explanation, so allow me to elaborate. Firstly, I am operating from a purely utilitarian moral standpoint here: that which gets the best results, for the most amount of people that I care about getting results for, is moral. Now, let's assume that the young women or children in question are outside of the group which I care for. Perhaps they're not of my tribe, perhaps they're not of my species. The men in question, obviously, are, and they desire sex. Since according to my moral standpoint of pure group-focused utilitarianism, the suffering of the women and children being raped is not a factor, only whether the group I care for gets more out of it than they put into it. So as long as the group I care for are not catching diseases from their rapes, and they're not being distracted from other things they need to be doing, like farming, waging war, or building things, then allowing them to rape the women and children of other groups is perfectly permissible. In fact, if their sexual desires are so frustrated that it's causing them problems, I may even find myself, [i]in full moral nessessity,[/i] [u]obliged[/u] to provide outsider women and children for them to take out their desires on, lest they get into fights with one another, or start raping members of the group which I do care about. In times of desperation, when there aren't enough women to go around normally, or my group have a decided taste for children, or rape, or raping children, that normal sex with adult consenting women cannot satisfy, I may even be forced to start making hard choices as to whether or not to permit some level of victimization of my own group's women and children, so as to keep the rest safe; doing a lottery of the women and children, and the losers get hauled into the brothel or whatever is necessary, assuming the sexual tension is growing severe and this is the most efficient way of dealing with it.

Alkahest wrote:

Your refusal to answer my questions is ample evidence for the strength of your argument. You have to make up a new argument in order to illustrate logic. That says something about the logic of your initial argument.