Greetings EP Forums, I am extremely interested in transhumanism concepts and gaming in such a environment. I have picked up all the books and read them but I am stuck by what appears to be a lack of meaning for the Aptitudes. If you look at page 174 of the main rules it has the Aptitude range. 6 to 10 is adult average, 11 to 15 is transhuman average. 26-30 is Post-Human. You can start/get Aptitudes of 40 (I have no idea what assessment that would have Singularity?) That aside the game was sold to me (by the brick and mortar store) as fairly realistic however the Aptitudes which define your character do not appear to have as much weight as would have expected. For example a character with a COGNITION of 1 is limited but can get a Physics skill of 99, the same as a character with a COGNITION of 40 can get a Physics skill of 99 (my background in real-life is a neurologist, currently researching how to we think/store information) by the rules there is no difference between the two characters skills.
But a person who is intellectually disabled (COG of 1) is not going to have the same understanding as a Einstein like genius (which is a COG of 20 max let alone 40) let alone a Transhuman in a Remade 2.0. There is also the physical side of things, SOMATICS 40 vs SOMATICS 10 etc. My question is how do you handle this in game play? My roleplaying group (We are playing our first session soon) consists of some very smart people who desire internal realism (we understand it is a sci fi game after all) but they will definitely want a to see a massive difference between a remade with COG 40 and a normal person and I do not know how to do that within the context of the rules. Would you have any advice for a first time Eclipse Phase GM? Have I missed something in the rules or ? Again thanks for for reading and any tips anyone cares to provide.
Warm Regards
Lenny
Welcome! These forums will be deactivated by the end of this year. The conversation continues in a new morph over on Discord! Please join us there for a more active conversation and the occasional opportunity to ask developers questions directly! Go to the PS+ Discord Server.
First Time EP GM seeking a bit of help
Sat, 2013-06-15 22:38
#1
LennyBravits
First Time EP GM seeking a bit of help
Sat, 2013-06-15 23:35
#2
Decivre
Welcome to the forums, Lenny.
Welcome to the forums, Lenny.
I've always justified the existence of characters with high skill and low aptitude as an exhibition of [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Savant_syndrome]savant syndrome[/url]. With mind enhancement becoming more and more common amongst transhumans, it's not that unexpected that many people with reduced mental function might still exhibit anomalous talents.
As for somatics, note that it isn't representative of actual strength, but your characters mental talent for controlling their body. This results in better performance in acts of strength, but is not perfectly analogous to strength itself. Somatics is a mental, not physical, trait.
I hope that helps.
—
Transhumans will one day be the Luddites of the posthuman age.
[url=http://bit.ly/2p3wk7c]Help me get my gaming fix, if you want.[/url]
Sun, 2013-06-16 00:10
#3
CodeBreaker
I rewrote this post so many
I rewrote this post so many times, you would not believe. Every single time my advise basically boiled down to one thing; Veto it. That might sound like a bullshit answer to your worries about the Eclipse Phase system not providing verisimilitude, and a hand-waive method of fixing the problem.
It is. But that is because it is the only way that you are going to stay sane as an Eclipse Phase GM. The Eclipse Phase setting is, in general, internally consistent. At its worst it gives a good, firm nod towards realism. At its best it is entirely realistic.
The Eclipse Phase system does not have the same caveats. It is not realistic. It doesn't try to be. If you want to try and simulate every single possibility that the system allows within the setting then you are bound for failure. The Eclipse Phase system is not intended to simulate a real world, it is meant to allow players to tell the story of (generally extremely skilled) individuals within that world.
Your example of a COG 1, Skill 99 character can exist within the system. It is really easy to do, in fact, if horrifically inefficient. By coming into the standard 1000CP character with no adherence to making something that looks the slightest bit realistic you can do some really stupid shit. But that doesn't mean you should, and it doesn't mean that you should let your players do it.
Maybe it is because it is so late (Eek, 5AM) and I am generally poor at making my case in text, but I am unsure how to say this in a tone that isn't blunt as fuck, so I won't try.
If you want the Eclipse Phase system to reflect the realistic world that it is intended to run, then you are going to be disappointed. It won't. It can't. It shouldn't.
If you want to tell kickass stories about characters who could realistically exist and whose capabilities are told by the system mechanics, then you will be just fine.
Goddamnit I didn't really answer your actual questions. Veto stupid shit that you don't think makes sense. At least in player characters. Do whatever you want with NPCs, those don't have to make sense, they just have to tell the story.
—
-
Sun, 2013-06-16 05:34
#4
Lu-Ka
We could use the ability as a
We could use the ability as a bonus to learning.
It would be easier and less costly in XP to improve its skill with an aptitude associated with a high level to a low level.
After all, in real life, it is easier for someone smart to learn that for a fool ...
Sun, 2013-06-16 06:49
#5
Decivre
Lu-Ka wrote:We could use the
A savant isn't a fool. It is a person deficient in mental capacity for one reason or another, who shows an anomalous talent for something. [url=http://www.neatorama.com/2008/09/05/10-most-fascinating-savants-in-the-w... is something that already exists today.[/url]
That said, high-aptitude characters already have severe advantages over low-aptitude characters. Besides having a respectable score when rolling for something unskilled, there's also the fact that it takes less points overall to get to a specific skill value. For a character with 10 COG, it takes 50 points to get to 60 with a COG-based skill... whereas for a character with 40 COG, it takes a mere 20. Furthermore, there are other advantages; willpower, somatics, intuition and reflexes all provide secondary bonuses that can't be gained through skills. The other three aptitudes have enough skills tied to them that it's actually more beneficial to purchase the aptitude if you plan to invest heavily in the skills tied to them.
—
Transhumans will one day be the Luddites of the posthuman age.
[url=http://bit.ly/2p3wk7c]Help me get my gaming fix, if you want.[/url]
Wed, 2013-06-19 03:03
#6
Justin Alexander
LennyBravits wrote:For
Several points:
First, the rules for character creation are not an education or genetics simulator. In other words, those rules will allow you to build all kinds of things. It doesn't necessarily mean that you should.
Second, there's a significant difference between the characters: One is broadly effective at a lot of different COG-based activities. The other is narrowly effective at Physics and probably grossly incompetent at most COG-based activities.
Third, aptitudes remain useful for three reasons: First, they represent broad competence. Second, they make skills considerably cheaper (COG 40 spent 59 CP specifically on Physics; COG 1 spent 138 CP). Third, there are a lot of rules which refer to the base aptitudes of the character.
For example, learning a new skill or memorizing information requires a COG x 3 test. Asynchs need to pass WIL + COG tests on critical failures. And so forth. Good luck passing any of those tests if your aptitudes are at 1.
I believe it's also impossible to create your hypothetical COG 1 character. The game requires a minimum COG 5 and there are no morphs in the core rulebook that inflict a COG penalty.
—
The Alexandrian
Wed, 2013-06-19 10:45
#7
nerol-1
Just an idea...
Ciao
Make the character creation more realstic like you is difficult.
You could set a maximum Character Points a PC can spend on a single skill, let's say 75 points for example. In this way, a COG of 1 or 20 will make a difference but a characther with COG 1 would still be able to reach a skill level of 76+10 for Specialization. Not bad at all.
Otherwise, the official rules say that you can spend 1 CP to improve a skill till 60, then it's 2 CP.
If you say a character spend 1 CP for the first 40 points spent to imrpove a skill (no mather the skill level), and than it will be 2 CP, a character with COG 1 will have some difficulties to have many high skills.
I did not modify Character creation rules, these are ideas I had reading you post.
I think the first case would work better.
Ciao
Luca
—
il NeRo
www.sentinellefirewall.blogspot.it
The blog about the adventures of 4 Italian Sentinels
Wed, 2013-06-19 12:37
#8
DivineWrath
Maybe as a house rule, you
Maybe as a house rule, you could rule that no one can buy more ranks in a skill than 3 to 4 times the rating of the linked aptitude. For instance, if you had an a COG aptitude of 10, then maybe you can't buy more than 40 ranks in Academics or Hardware (bringing the total to 50). Anymore ranks in such a skill and it would be more than 4 times the linked aptitude.
The exception of course might be a Savant character, but I'm not in the mood to get into something like that at the moment.
Play with that idea and let us know it that works out.