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I finally get the Rep System

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Fri, 2010-12-17 14:40

TBRMInsanity TBRMInsanity's picture

I finally get the Rep System

http://video.ted.com/talks/podcast/RachelBotsman_2010X.mp4 I love to watch TED and this particular talk is about a future collaborative world where everything is shared and people trust each other, even though they don't know each other. The glue to this system and what makes it work is... Reputation. Hmm, that sounds familiar. Check it out and tell me what you think.

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Jovian Motto: Your mind is original. Preserve it. Your body is a temple. Maintain it. Immortality is an illusion. Forget it.

Sun, 2010-12-19 11:45

bakho

Re: I finally get the Rep System

I think I found it on TED as a live stream, so people don't have to download it - http://www.ted.com/talks/rachel_botsman_the_case_for_collaborative_consu... (check it out TBRM, if it's the same thing you shared, I think it is) Love the presentation. Especially the 'I promise you that in a few years you will be able to google someone's online reputation'. *trudges off to check out Swaptree, have some books to share*

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The only principle t

Sun, 2010-12-19 14:42

TBRMInsanity TBRMInsanity's picture

Re: I finally get the Rep System

Yeah that is the same presentation. Yeah I've been checking out some of the sites to trade out some of my old movies I don't watch any more as well.

—

Jovian Motto: Your mind is original. Preserve it. Your body is a temple. Maintain it. Immortality is an illusion. Forget it.

Sun, 2010-12-19 17:50

Extrasolar Angel Extrasolar Angel's picture

Re: I finally get the Rep System

Quote:
Love the presentation. Especially the 'I promise you that in a few years you will be able to google someone's online reputation'.

Doubt it. There are many people, including young ones, that stay of the net regarding their personal identity.

—

[I]Raise your hands to the sky and break the chains. With transhumanism we can smash the matriarchy together.[/i]

Sun, 2010-12-19 18:23

Draconis

Re: I finally get the Rep System

Entirely true. There are those of us like myself with no Twitter, Facebook, Myspace, nor anything else and intend on keeping it that way.

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[img]http://boxall.no-ip.org/img/infected_userbar.jpg[/img]
[img]http://boxall.no-ip.org/img/exh_userbar.jpg[/img]

"Do not ask who I am and do not ask me to remain the same" - Michel Foucault

Sun, 2010-12-19 18:33

Picollo

Re: I finally get the Rep System

root@Picollo@Rep System [hr]

Draconis wrote:
Entirely true. There are those of us like myself with no Twitter, Facebook, Myspace, nor anything else and intend on keeping it that way.

And then there are the kids who think that not having a Facebook account is tantamount to admitting to being a serial killer. *sigh* Gods I feel old.

—

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Sun, 2010-12-19 18:42

Axel the Chimeric Axel the Chimeric's picture

Re: I finally get the Rep System

The Internet: Now narcissist friendly!

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[img]http://img813.imageshack.us/img813/982/exhumanbar.jpg[/img] [img]http://img804.imageshack.us/img804/4473/scumbar.jpg[/img] [img]http://img818.imageshack.us/img818/1396/gatecrasherbar.jpg[/img] [code][@-rep +1, f-rep +2][/code]

Sun, 2010-12-19 18:48

Draconis

Re: I finally get the Rep System

Let them get burned. Did you notice how CNN has constant spots on "Online Privacy"? Eventually these 'tards will figure out that anything you put on the net can be accessed by those you don't want to access it and it stays out there forever. I can't wait for the near future when these morons try and run for office and their old facebook caches are dug up and paraded around for others to see. Look at Christine O'Donnell or the Miss Universe tapes. That was old fashioned video, not even the juicy digital stuff that's being provided these days. Whoops.

—

[img]http://boxall.no-ip.org/img/infected_userbar.jpg[/img]
[img]http://boxall.no-ip.org/img/exh_userbar.jpg[/img]

"Do not ask who I am and do not ask me to remain the same" - Michel Foucault

Mon, 2010-12-20 00:08

750

Re: I finally get the Rep System

She tiptoed around the elephant in the room tho, p2p file-"sharing". If there is any area where this change will produce a bitter fight, it is there. I find myself wondering why not "bus" services have changed into something more like a shared taxi service. Either by phone or by distributed fixed devices one can enter a to and from, and once a limit of riders, within a given proximity, have been reached a "bus" is dispatched to carry that group of people. This rather then driving near empty buses at fixed intervals along fixed routes.

Mon, 2010-12-20 11:23

#10

bakho

Re: I finally get the Rep System

TBRMInsanity wrote:
Yeah that is the same presentation. Yeah I've been checking out some of the sites to trade out some of my old movies I don't watch any more as well.

Unfortunately, swap.com seems to be limited to the US. And here I wanted to get rid off those pesky DnD 4e books... :D

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The only principle t

Mon, 2010-12-20 12:24

#11

Extrasolar Angel Extrasolar Angel's picture

Re: I finally get the Rep System

Quote:
I find myself wondering why not "bus" services have changed into something more like a shared taxi service. Either by phone or by distributed fixed devices one can enter a to and from, and once a limit of riders, within a given proximity, have been reached a "bus" is dispatched to carry that group of people. This rather then driving near empty buses at fixed intervals along fixed routes.

Ah the terror of social majority tyranny. Nothing beats having a public swimming pool to myself or a bus for that matter.

—

[I]Raise your hands to the sky and break the chains. With transhumanism we can smash the matriarchy together.[/i]

Mon, 2010-12-20 20:36

#12

750

Re: I finally get the Rep System

bakho wrote:
TBRMInsanity wrote:
Yeah that is the same presentation. Yeah I've been checking out some of the sites to trade out some of my old movies I don't watch any more as well.
Unfortunately, swap.com seems to be limited to the US. And here I wanted to get rid off those pesky DnD 4e books... :D

sadly i am a packrat, so i could never see myself give up any rpg book...

Tue, 2010-12-21 14:27

#13

bakho

Re: I finally get the Rep System

Even one that bad? :D

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The only principle t

Tue, 2010-12-21 21:24

#14

TBRMInsanity TBRMInsanity's picture

Re: I finally get the Rep System

I have a bunch of 3.0e DnD books that I couldn't pay someone to take off my hands.

—

Jovian Motto: Your mind is original. Preserve it. Your body is a temple. Maintain it. Immortality is an illusion. Forget it.

Tue, 2011-01-11 12:13

#15

The Doctor The Doctor's picture

Re: I finally get the Rep System

Picollo wrote:
And then there are the kids who think that not having a Facebook account is tantamount to admitting to being a serial killer. *sigh* Gods I feel old.

"You don't have a Facebook account!" is the new "Never trust anyone over thirty."

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Thu, 2011-01-13 12:47

#16

Saerain

Re: I finally get the Rep System

Draconis wrote:
Let them get burned. Did you notice how CNN has constant spots on "Online Privacy"? Eventually these 'tards will figure out that anything you put on the net can be accessed by those you don't want to access it and it stays out there forever. I can't wait for the near future when these morons try and run for office and their old facebook caches are dug up and paraded around for others to see. Look at Christine O'Donnell or the Miss Universe tapes. That was old fashioned video, not even the juicy digital stuff that's being provided these days. Whoops.

I don't understand this. Most of us aren't secret agents, and if someone has done something that would keep them in some way from holding public office, maybe they should be, hey, kept from holding public office. Not that Christine O'Donnell needed Bill Maher's help to show us how airheaded she was. How naive am I? To me, people expressing your sentiments are concerned with a definition of privacy that I suspect I'll never be able to see it in a terribly positive light.

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Thu, 2011-01-13 19:20

#17

Arenamontanus Arenamontanus's picture

Re: I finally get the Rep System

A transparent society with a long memory is great if it is tolerant. If it isn't tolerant, then we have a problem. This is IMHO why it is very urgent in real life to ensure better civil control over governments and continually protect various freedoms - otherwise we might end up in a transparent society where you end up in trouble for that climate sceptic, pro-corporate or anti-religious post you did years ago. Sure, right now it is nice and tolerant, but in 40 years? As tech develops it becomes more important to not just keep the current system nice but also future systems. "Are you, or have you ever been, a member of the People's Extropian Front?"

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Fri, 2011-01-14 01:28

#18

root

Re: I finally get the Rep System

root@I finally get the Rep System [hr] Isn't context one of the benefits of a transparent society? Sure, people might want to point out that you did something stupid at some previous time, but that can be done to anyone already. The transparent society makes it far more likely that it isn't shocking. Do people really think the embarrassing things they've done are very unique? Those depths have been visited by people on worse trajectories, so people matter more about what you have done recently. If you were known to be dancing in the street in nothing but a top hat and a pogo stick last week, I might not vote for you. If it was a few years ago, so what?

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[ @-rep +1 | c-rep +1 | g-rep +1 | r-rep +1 ]

Fri, 2011-01-14 11:09

#19

Arenamontanus Arenamontanus's picture

Re: I finally get the Rep System

root wrote:
Isn't context one of the benefits of a transparent society?

It is really easy to read the original article pointed to by an inflammatory blog post, yet the vast majority of commenters never even check it out. Plenty of people today have been burned by out-of context statements that are really simple to check out.

Quote:
Do people really think the embarrassing things they've done are very unique? Those depths have been visited by people on worse trajectories, so people matter more about what you have done recently.

I sincerely hope so. But right now we see people hounded from public office for things most people do not regard as bad if they or their friends do it (a government minister in Sweden got thrown out for not paying her TV licence several years back)... while others get away with rather serious things because they do not excite the public (how many can follow an ordinary corruption trial?)

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Fri, 2011-01-14 13:24

#20

Extrasolar Angel Extrasolar Angel's picture

Re: I finally get the Rep System

Quote:
while others get away with rather serious things because they do not excite the public (how many can follow an ordinary corruption trial?

It's also because people do not make moral choices by default. People might actually prefer a corrupt politician to a clean one-especially in a society where corruption is widely accepted, or that funny politician who engages in sexual affairs with young women might be preferable to one with an unattractive old wife.

—

[I]Raise your hands to the sky and break the chains. With transhumanism we can smash the matriarchy together.[/i]

Tue, 2011-01-18 14:04

#21

Ataraxzy

Re: I finally get the Rep System

Extrasolar Angel wrote:
Quote:
while others get away with rather serious things because they do not excite the public (how many can follow an ordinary corruption trial?
It's also because people do not make moral choices by default. People might actually prefer a corrupt politician to a clean one-especially in a society where corruption is widely accepted, or that funny politician who engages in sexual affairs with young women might be preferable to one with an unattractive old wife.

What Extrasolar Angel is touching on here is the idea that [i]choices are not transitive[/i] in economic systems. By extension, [i]values are not transitive[/i] either. This is the concept that lies at the heart of [url=https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/Arrow%27s_impossibility_t...'s Impossibility Theorem[/url].

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Tue, 2011-01-18 15:33

#22

root

Re: I finally get the Rep System

root@I finally get the Rep System [hr]

Ataraxzy wrote:
What Extrasolar Angel is touching on here is the idea that [i]choices are not transitive[/i] in economic systems. By extension, [i]values are not transitive[/i] either. This is the concept that lies at the heart of [url=https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/Arrow%27s_impossibility_t...'s Impossibility Theorem[/url].

Social choice theory and election theory are new to me. Could you explain them in a bit more detail?

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[ @-rep +1 | c-rep +1 | g-rep +1 | r-rep +1 ]

Tue, 2011-01-18 17:06

#23

Ataraxzy

Re: I finally get the Rep System

Sure. Start here: http://www.colorado.edu/education/DMP/voting_a.html Read that, and then follow the last two links on that page and read those too. The one about the fourth-graders is funny. That covers Arrow's Impossibility Theorem. As for Social Choice Theory, Amartya Sen's Nobel Laureate lecture covers the history and the basics pretty well: http://nobelprize.org/nobel_prizes/economics/laureates/1998/sen-lecture.pdf You might also find Arrow's 1972 Nobel Laureate lecture interesting, though I haven't read it: http://nobelprize.org/nobel_prizes/economics/laureates/1972/arrow-lectur... Lastly, for a deeply technical sense of what is going on, and combining the two ideas is, Chapter 9 of the book Multiagent Systems. The book talks quite extensively about the issues with defining [i]any[/i] sort of decision-making process that involves more than three outcomes. It's a book on designing AI expert systems (right up our singulatarian ally!) and the whole work is available free online here: http://www.masfoundations.org/download.html

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Thu, 2011-01-20 12:03

#24

Ataraxzy

Re: I finally get the Rep System

And two days after I post this, Tyler Cowen posts all about Public Choice and where to go to understand it: http://www.marginalrevolution.com/marginalrevolution/2011/01/public-choi...

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Thu, 2011-01-20 17:22

#25

root

Re: I finally get the Rep System

root@I finally get the Rep System [hr]

Ataraxzy wrote:
Lastly, for a deeply technical sense of what is going on, and combining the two ideas is, Chapter 9 of the book Multiagent Systems. The book talks quite extensively about the issues with defining [i]any[/i] sort of decision-making process that involves more than three outcomes. It's a book on designing AI expert systems (right up our singulatarian ally!) and the whole work is available free online here: http://www.masfoundations.org/download.html

Why, thank you. This will be a fun read. Full disclosure requires me to mention the full-on Mad Scientist cackle that burst forth when I downloaded this. Ataraxzy r-rep++

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[ @-rep +1 | c-rep +1 | g-rep +1 | r-rep +1 ]

Thu, 2011-02-17 04:54

#26

Decivre

Re: I finally get the Rep System

Arenamontanus wrote:
A transparent society with a long memory is great if it is tolerant. If it isn't tolerant, then we have a problem. This is IMHO why it is very urgent in real life to ensure better civil control over governments and continually protect various freedoms - otherwise we might end up in a transparent society where you end up in trouble for that climate sceptic, pro-corporate or anti-religious post you did years ago. Sure, right now it is nice and tolerant, but in 40 years? As tech develops it becomes more important to not just keep the current system nice but also future systems. "Are you, or have you ever been, a member of the People's Extropian Front?"

I agree. This merely goes to show that our society has to become more accepting of people's mistakes and flaws. Currently, politicians can be denigrating for such trivial things as a minor utterance that occurred years ago, or even their weekend hobby of war re-enactment. This sort of social trend has to stop if we're going to move forward into a world where trust is the new economic structure.

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Transhumans will one day be the Luddites of the posthuman age. [url=http://bit.ly/2p3wk7c]Help me get my gaming fix, if you want.[/url]