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When we practice to deceive, oh what webs we weave!

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Fri, 2010-09-10 16:37

PhishStyx

When we practice to deceive, oh what webs we weave!

Yikes, soon they'll really be able to beat us at poker! http://www.slashgear.com/researchers-develop-algorithms-that-let-robots-...

Sat, 2010-09-11 12:39

Rhyx

Re: When we practice to deceive, oh what webs we weave!

And why in the hell would anyone want a robot to lie to them? I understand that this is probably a way to get a DARPA grant but do we really want the following scenario to occur: "Computer, did you send the maintenance bots to fix the problem with the airlock?" "Suuure did boss!" PPPFFFWISSSHHHH! "Sucker!"

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Sat, 2010-09-11 19:19

root

Re: When we practice to deceive, oh what webs we weave!

root@When we practice to deceive, oh what webs we weave! [hr] It can prevent lockups in the computer system. One of the fun explorations Issac Asimov did with his three laws of robotics was to put the robots in situations where they would shut down because they had now way to continue to follow the three laws without lying, which was considered harmful. Look through your daily life and think about what it would be like to be forced to be honest in every thought and deed, including the inability to lie by omission. The world is too complex for honesty.

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Fri, 2010-09-17 12:34

Xahn Borealis Xahn Borealis's picture

Re: When we practice to deceive, oh what webs we weave!

You'd probably end up with a situation similar to The Invention of Lying, where everyone automatically assumes you will be honest, so accepts everything you say as truth. :D

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Fri, 2010-09-17 13:46

TBRMInsanity TBRMInsanity's picture

Re: When we practice to deceive, oh what webs we weave!

root wrote:
root@When we practice to deceive, oh what webs we weave! [hr] It can prevent lockups in the computer system. One of the fun explorations Issac Asimov did with his three laws of robotics was to put the robots in situations where they would shut down because they had now way to continue to follow the three laws without lying, which was considered harmful. Look through your daily life and think about what it would be like to be forced to be honest in every thought and deed, including the inability to lie by omission. The world is too complex for honesty.

I would see the Aes Sedai approach of "the truth you heard may not be the truth I told" happening. I never did like the 3 laws, I much prefer the child of the creator complex instead. Have future AI feel that they are our children and program into them the concept of taking care of your parents when they can no longer take care of themselves. I think this will produce AI that truly have our best interests at heart and will do everything they can to keep us healthy, and comfortable. The question is would you like to be a part of a robot controlled "old folks home", even if it was a utopia?

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Jovian Motto: Your mind is original. Preserve it. Your body is a temple. Maintain it. Immortality is an illusion. Forget it.

Fri, 2010-09-17 15:12

Arenamontanus Arenamontanus's picture

Re: When we practice to deceive, oh what webs we weave!

TBRMInsanity wrote:
I never did like the 3 laws, I much prefer the child of the creator complex instead. Have future AI feel that they are our children and program into them the concept of taking care of your parents when they can no longer take care of themselves. I think this will produce AI that truly have our best interests at heart and will do everything they can to keep us healthy, and comfortable. The question is would you like to be a part of a robot controlled "old folks home", even if it was a utopia?

There is that exchange in Freefall: http://freefall.purrsia.com/ff1500/fc01475.htm "And maybe the only reason robots exist is to create the life form that comes after you. And when that lifeform asks "Where are your creators?", what do you plan to tell it?" "Probably something like "Let's go meet the neighbors." "Better be careful... the moment humans find out they've become grand creators, they're going to spoil your kid rotten."

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Fri, 2010-09-17 16:20

TBRMInsanity TBRMInsanity's picture

Re: When we practice to deceive, oh what webs we weave!

Arenamontanus wrote:
There is that exchange in Freefall: http://freefall.purrsia.com/ff1500/fc01475.htm "And maybe the only reason robots exist is to create the life form that comes after you. And when that lifeform asks "Where are your creators?", what do you plan to tell it?" "Probably something like "Let's go meet the neighbors." "Better be careful... the moment humans find out they've become grand creators, they're going to spoil your kid rotten."

:D I really need to start following Freefall. I would totally spoil my grand creations rotten and tell them war stories. "Back in my day we couldn't do self improvements on the fly. I had to go to school for 25 years."

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Jovian Motto: Your mind is original. Preserve it. Your body is a temple. Maintain it. Immortality is an illusion. Forget it.

Tue, 2010-10-05 22:51

Decivre

Re: When we practice to deceive, oh what webs we weave!

Rhyx wrote:
And why in the hell would anyone want a robot to lie to them? I understand that this is probably a way to get a DARPA grant but do we really want the following scenario to occur: "Computer, did you send the maintenance bots to fix the problem with the airlock?" "Suuure did boss!" PPPFFFWISSSHHHH! "Sucker!"

Deception is pretty integral to modern society, and even simplistic software has been designed to "lie". The most effective viruses are designed to fool and spoof systems into believing that nothing is wrong. It's perfectly natural progress that thinking machines would follow suit, and be at least as capable as simpler ancestor code.

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