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Romantic Neural Interface

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Steel Accord Steel Accord's picture
Romantic Neural Interface
I was watching Pacific Rim for the first time, and I liked the concept of "The Drift." For those who don't know, it's the phenomenon of two brains linking with each other; sharing memories and thoughts in particular. In the movie, it's shown the pilots have to have compatible personalities in order for the Drift to work and a strong bond helps immensely in the process. Most of the pilots are siblings therefore. Now just at the halfway point on the movie, it's clear to two leads are fostering a romantic connection. This got me thinking of what it would be like to become that intimately connected to someone I love. To share our memories, feelings, and thoughts on that level. I would at least try it. It might bring our relationship to a whole new level! My question to all of you is, would you? If you aren't in a relationship at the moment, just pretend you are. (I know I do. XD)
Your passion is power. Focus it. Your body is a tool. Hone it. Transhummanity is a pantheon. Exalt it!
Koolaid Koolaid's picture
Sort of Scary.
I haven't seen Pacific Rim. To share all thoughts and memories with my wife... at first glance I think, well, we are in love, why would we not want to? But there's a lot of history there. Bad feelings. Doubt, anger, shame, guilt. The white lies. The things I don't talk about for a reason. Not because I'm hiding who I am, but because I'm done being that person. She's gone through depression bouts, parental abuse. We've talked about these things, of course. But it's filtered. To experience a select few things - a memory here and there - that would be okay, either direction. But for everything to run together? Overwhelming. We connect well enough during sex.
Steel Accord Steel Accord's picture
Understood
I get that. Such an experience would be very different for each pair as according to their respective experiences. I know my former girlfriend has been through some very rough times and suffers from epilepsy. I guess a part of my motivation is my inability to truly understand and express. If we didn't have the filter of words and could just "feel" each other's experiences. I would gladly share her pain.
Your passion is power. Focus it. Your body is a tool. Hone it. Transhummanity is a pantheon. Exalt it!
bibliophile20 bibliophile20's picture
I keep thinking of this
I keep thinking of this [url=http://www.schlockmercenary.com/2011-12-22]Schlock Mercenary strip[/url]. That being said, I'm guilty of wondering on this concept myself; I've used it myself in some fanfic I wrote way back when, and touched on the concept for some EP homebrew that I wrote up (as well as mentioned in the side in the EP fiction I wrote a year and a half or so ago)

"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote." -Benjamin Franklin

Lorsa Lorsa's picture
Yes I think I would like that
Yes I think I would like that for two reasons. I am a very curious person and being able to truly see he world from someone else's view would be amazing. The sort of empathy and understanding that would bring is definitely something I would like for myself. Having shared myself so completely with another person also means I can feel completely accepted (given that they still want to be close to me). That form of acceptance and the relaxation it would bring is very hard to accomplish without such a sharing.
Lorsa is a Forum moderator [color=red]Red text is for moderator stuff[/color]
nezumi.hebereke nezumi.hebereke's picture
My guess? It's going to up
My guess? It's going to up your ups and down your downs. Sure, during the honeymoon period it's fantastic. She thinks you're wonderful, which makes you feel wonderful towards her, and it becomes a loop. But then do you want her also 'hearing' when you lay in bed and wonder 'what if'? When you think fondly of your ex? When she really does look fat in that? Do you want to be looking into her head when she's thinking those things? Don't imagine that you'll only get to use it when things are working well. If the technology is there, it's there. Available technology gets used. Sure, people who grow up with it and feel comfortable walking around naked in someone else's living room will certainly have a degree of emotional intimacy the rest of us can only dream of (although there will certainly be other unintended consequences. Higher suicide rate? Greater self-delusion to protect ourselves?) As for me, I'm happy letting my wife moderate her thoughts when we interact. A little privacy is good, even within a marriage.
Kremlin K.O.A. Kremlin K.O.A.'s picture
Not something I would partake
Not something I would partake of, and if it became an expected standard of romance, I would go the eternal hermit route. Why? The primal parts of me... it would be unethical in the extreme to inflict them on any other being.
bibliophile20 bibliophile20's picture
My homebrewed concept around
My homebrewed concept around this idea: Summer's Day A nanodrug and performance booster cocktail, Summer's Day is, bluntly put, a sexual performance and intimacy-boosting drug for the "hopelessly monogamous". Distributed as either a rose (making some mistake it for a form of petal) or a large sugar heart or other "romantic" candy divided into two distinct portions, the drug is consumed by a pair of individuals. For the drug's duration, it creates a low-level XP feed back and forth between the pair, comprising mostly of surface thoughts and hormonal responses (while being careful to block the formation of dangerous feedback loops; early users often experienced heart attacks or strokes during the drug's peak effect), while at the same time, the drug meddles with hormone and neurotransmitter production, particularly serotonin, dopamine, oxytocin, and other hormones, giving both users a feeling of intimacy, euphoria, and reduced anxiety, as well as boosting physical performance and reinforcing pair bonds. [Low to Moderate] Type: Nanodrug, App: O, Onset: 20 minutes. Duration: 2 hours. Addiction modifier: 0. Addiction: Mental.

"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote." -Benjamin Franklin

Undocking Undocking's picture
I wouldn't want that for a
I wouldn't want that for a relationship. I would want that for myself. I'd fork myself into a clone and use it to maintain synchronisty in multiplicity with the goal of extended physical reach and mental performance of my consciousness. In the last game I played in, I had to work at actually creating a character that could function as a hive mind. Parallel processors from Rimward, Mental Speed, Transhuman's Established Fork stunt, buying enough morphs, the psycho-surgury disadvantages, . I went above my usual limit for CP in gear... but I had hell of a fun time.
ShadowDragon8685 ShadowDragon8685's picture
It should surprise absolutely
It should surprise absolutely no-one that [url=http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/MindlinkMates]there's a trope for that.[/url] It's one of those really romantic-seeming ideas that, in practice, would probably lead lead to you needing to be rolled all the way back to your last backup. No backups? Well, you're screwed. Then again, if experiencing others' inputs directly, ala XPs, is possible without massively fucking someone up from the get-go, then mindlinking with someone shouldn't. It'll be the long-term psychological aspects that winds up fucking you up.
Skype and AIM names: Exactly the same as my forum name. [url=http://tinyurl.com/mfcapss]My EP Character Questionnaire[/url] [url=http://tinyurl.com/lbpsb93]Thread for my Questionnaire[/url] [url=http://tinyurl.com/obu5adp]The Five Orange Pips[/url]
Steel Accord Steel Accord's picture
Caveat
For all those protesting, I should have mentioned the specifics. The Rift, as portrayed in the film, is a temporary link. Obviously, such a constant feed from one's lover would be welcomed in some respects, but would quickly lead to information overload at the very least. In my case, it's an implant I certainly wouldn't mind sharing with a special someone.
Your passion is power. Focus it. Your body is a tool. Hone it. Transhummanity is a pantheon. Exalt it!
Kassil Kassil's picture
I dunno about you, but I
I dunno about you, but I wouldn't subject anyone to the interior zone of my mind. It's the place where nightmares go to die and just the peripheral contact via me running games has left some people with nightmares. :P (True story. On one occasion, I had to change a game because a player started having nightmares about the creepy bastard of a nemesis monster I'd put in for their character.) That aside, what happens if an async uses this kind of link? Could it infect the other person with Watts-McLeod?
"Don't eat the jelly, that's a protoplasm someone sleeved into."
Freedom Geek Freedom Geek's picture
Kevin Warwick has been talking

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Pyrite Pyrite's picture
It's something I could only
It's something I could only concieve of doing with my significant other once we'd reached a point in our life of incredible stability and overcome a lot of current stumbling blocks. It would answer a lot of questions we weren't ready to ask in an ungentle, un-nuanced way.
'No language is justly studied merely as an aid to other purposes. It will in fact better serve other purposes, philological or historical, when it is studied for love, for itself.' --J.R.R. Tolkien
Smokeskin Smokeskin's picture
I think that everyone has an
I think that everyone has an inner life that is very different from the persons that we really are. We have thoughts and impulses that are just random stuff from our imaginations, and thoughts and impulses from our "reptilian brain" that we don't act on because we're decent, civilzed people, etc. Getting that inner life exposed in our current society would probably cause quite a bit of embarassment at best, but that's not the case with such an interface. It would be sharing, and most likely your partner would have the some sort of impulses. It is really interesting what would happen. Would we be mutually offended at our impulses and lose respect for eachother over ridiculous day dreams? Or would we accept our partner's inner life and find a deeper level of honesty and mutual satisfaction as all the misunderstandings and facades and deceptions are removed? How would you react to read your partner's mind and find it as strange as your own?
uwtartarus uwtartarus's picture
I have had to argue about
I have had to argue about whether a lack of inhibitions represents "an honest, true version" as though alcohol or recreational substance remove a false mask on our identities. I disagree with this notion, I think that our "masks" and "inhibitions" and what we choose to not reveal is part of our identity just as much as the whimsy and inner most thoughts. So I agree with you, Smokeskin, though I wouldn't tell another couple to not try something like that. Just as I won't tell polygamous people not to experiment with that, just because I am comfortable with monogamy and not sharing every single emotion or thought in my flawed and imperfect mind with my partner.
Exhuman, and Humanitarian.
Smokeskin Smokeskin's picture
uwtartarus wrote:I have had
uwtartarus wrote:
I have had to argue about whether a lack of inhibitions represents "an honest, true version" as though alcohol or recreational substance remove a false mask on our identities. I disagree with this notion, I think that our "masks" and "inhibitions" and what we choose to not reveal is part of our identity just as much as the whimsy and inner most thoughts.
I won't disagree with you on that. What I meant was that if you look into someone's head and see thoughts that are very different from the person they otherwise appear to be, you shouldn't assume that they are a different person than you prevoiusly thought and were hiding their true self. People should be judged on what they do more than what they think. It is the end result that matters, after we've applied our filters, self control, morals and sacrifices, not the spontaneity, egotism and impulsiveness of our original thoughts.
Quote:
So I agree with you, Smokeskin, though I wouldn't tell another couple to not try something like that. Just as I won't tell polygamous people not to experiment with that, just because I am comfortable with monogamy and not sharing every single emotion or thought in my flawed and imperfect mind with my partner.
I meant what I said as a true question. I don't know if we're able to handle getting exposed to our partner's inner feelings. I think that if we could it would be for the better but I am not sure we could overcome it. I mostly practice brutal honesty, and it isn't always easy. For example I mostly tell my wife what I think of her clothing and her looks. In many cases it works out quite well - she knows exactly what I like and when she wants to look good for me she can nail it, while for most of her wardrobe she's learned to not care and gets what she wants instead. I think that works better than her getting what she thinks we both like, based on white lies I would have told her not to hurt her feelings. But sometimes, she does get a bit hurt. My experience with brutal honesty is that it gets you higher highs and lower lows. Now scale that up to a neural interface. Will the lows become so low that it ruins everything? Can we handle to honestly experience the weirdness, the waxing and waning of attraction, the occasional annoyance and anger? But imagine if we can learn to live with that. If we could get immediate feedback and learn to have the exact effect on our partner that we wanted. If we didn't have to doubt and second guess. If misunderstanding didn't happen, and that thing you did without noticing that mad her upset could get corrected immeditedly instead.
consumerdestroyer consumerdestroyer's picture
Thomas Metzinger makes a
Thomas Metzinger makes a pretty good case in [i]Being No One[/i] (and the subsequent version of [i]Being No One[/i] for general audiences, [i]The Ego Tunnel[/i], which I recommend if you're not 100% up to snuff on contemporary neuroscience and philosophy of mind) that we actually don't have a self as distinct from the workings of the brain that Smokeskin is referring to here, and takes an opposing stance to uwtartarus' view in the sense that while Metzinger would agree that the "masks" are "just as much" a part of the self as the inner chaotic churnings, that "just as much" wouldn't be an indicator of parts that make up the whole (as in uwtartarus' stance) but instead that they would be just as irrelevant to the constitution of a concept of "self" (or "soul" or "will" or "mind" or "I" or what have you). I think one of the things about this setting that's interesting is that because it's a complete picture of your brain, it includes all of the informatic occlusion that just comes standard with being a homo sapiens, including the informatic occlusion that blinds us to the processes that delude us or trick us. Children stand in front of the magician as he performs his coin trick, and think magic is being done (i.e. "I" think "my" "self" is real), but an adult stands behind the magician (the field of neuroscience ever more rapidly cracking the black box of the brain as the 21st century marches on) and sees exactly how it's done (i.e. the neural correlates for various parts of "self-awareness" and other forms of self identity always happen prior to consciousness of the totality). It's sort of like flash fusion, which is when a light blinks faster and faster until the human eye sees a solid light, but researchers looking at a screen can see how many times per minute it's flashing. The aggregate experience of our brains, moment to moment, forms a flash fusion of the various limited drips of information that gets filtered through our thalamocortical system (and other systems, but this seems to be the final sifter from current research) from the massive overload we'd get otherwise, arranges it in time (sometimes erroneously, as multiple witnesses to a single crime can attest) and that DIY, jury-rigger flash fusion we believe is this magic "self", even though actually it's just all the moments of our lives appearing solid enough to categorize and label (when in actual fact each "flash" dies away and does not live on in any meaningful way, including the one you're having right now reading this). This is a vast oversimplification, but it's the best analogy I've found, and it's also an approximation of the actual neural correlates that happen (i.e. flash fusion and the perception of a "self" in our thoughts, although you've have to mix in another visual correlate: that of visual anosognosia). tl;dr Bleeding edge neuroscience is confirming with ever-greater certainty: Buddha was right all along, the self is illusory.
Smokeskin Smokeskin's picture
consumerdestroyer wrote:we
consumerdestroyer wrote:
we actually don't have a self as distinct from the workings of the brain that Smokeskin is referring to here
That's just my inadequacies in communication that gives that impression, or maybe it is just our language that is imprecise :) I don't think we have any self distinct from the brain. It's like "I saw the sun rise" - when the reality is that the Earth rotated so photons from the sun could reach my eye.
consumerdestroyer consumerdestroyer's picture
Smokeskin wrote
Smokeskin wrote:
consumerdestroyer wrote:
we actually don't have a self as distinct from the workings of the brain that Smokeskin is referring to here
That's just my inadequacies in communication that gives that impression, or maybe it is just our language that is imprecise :) I don't think we have any self distinct from the brain. It's like "I saw the sun rise" - when the reality is that the Earth rotated so photons from the sun could reach my eye.
Yes, exactly! Heliocentrism within our solar system was counter-intuitive because, well, geocentrism [i]was what we experienced[/i]. Same goes with noocentrism...but science has a way of dethroning the counter-intuitive ego trips of (not so) great apes.
consumerdestroyer consumerdestroyer's picture
This thread and hard science
This thread and hard science feeds into my use of horror in Eclipse Phase, by the way. I like the idea of lovers trying to "know one another completely" and finding out that there was no one to love in the first place...in themselves or in the other. When people say Firewall missions are the only way to do horror in this setting, it's stuff like this that gives me Liggoti/Cardin-esque hope/crushing despair. :)
Undocking Undocking's picture
consumerdestroyer wrote:This
consumerdestroyer wrote:
This thread and hard science feeds into my use of horror in Eclipse Phase, by the way. I like the idea of lovers trying to "know one another completely"
A sylph morph roams around the drug dens of Mars, paying for narcals with fantastic sex paired with shared neural feedback. The romantic neural interface introduces a basilisk hack that leave them physically unchanged but potential exsurgent agents at anytime. Both her exsurgent nature and her unconditional love for transhumans are known to her victims the moment they jack in.